Topic: Do we aspire to recreate junk?

[George]

I know that I'm no longer very interested in typical, average BIR fare. I'm only interested in dishes which taste way above average. I can see what the chef in the following article means:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2015490/Drunks-tinned-food-tikka-masala--chef-says-Indian-restaurants-got-wrong.html

[Curry Barking Mad]

Hi George,
A very interesting article.
I have no problem with the author says and it does make a lot of sense.
I like authentic cuisine as well, however, I think there will always be a place for standard BIR food.
I certainly don't aspire to cook junk and I wouldn't call a full flavoured Jalfrezi junk.
Most of us understand the reasons that BIR food exists and I for one am glad that the early Bengali chefs created dishes for 'our' palate. ;D
As you are no longer interested in average BIR fare, does this site now not supply you with what you are looking for?
Good find on the article.
Cheers,
Mick

[Razor]

Hi George,

Good article and an interesting read.

To be fair though, I think many Indian restaurants are changing their ways these days.  Where I live, there are at least 3 premier Indian restaurants that cater for the more discerning customer.  I would describe these establishments as 'family' orientated' restaurants.

I also think that the modern BIR/TA menu is changing and changing for the better.  Many new dishes appearing on the menu that you wouldn't have seen 20 or 30 years ago.

He makes a good point with regards to the quality and quantity of food being prepared in restaurants of other cuisines.  French cuisine, in my opinion, has always been overpriced, and sadly, Italian food is heading in the same direction.  Good tactics on the part of the restaurant owners really.  Charge more for less = less work, better profits and affords the restaurant to target a "calmer" customer.

It's amazing how he describes dishes made with 'onion gravy' with such disdain, as a good 90 percent of the UK BIR's make their curries this way.

Surely, he must have a team in before service doing all the prep work?  How different can their prep be to a standard BIR?  It suggests that he doesn't make an onion gravy but makes the dishes from fresh?

As for the question 'Do we aspire to recreate junk?'  No, is my answer, I aspire to create a dish that makes people go 'wow'.   I want to make a dish that people will make comments such as 'That's the best bhuna I've ever had' or 'are you sure that you have made this?'

Can I achieve this by making a dish that has only cost me 2 quid to make?  definitely yes, if I make plenty of it.  Is it Junk?, definitely no, all my ingredients are fresh and of good quality. Can the same be said of a standard BIR/TA?  I suspect the answer would be No.

Good find George, an interesting thought provoking article.

Ray

[coogan]

No. He does make some good points but I do think he is talking of establishments of yesteryear I do believe standards having greatly improved of late. Anyway I do try to create dishes that are better then what your average TA or BIR mass produce. I never use any pastes or any other shortcuts other then a few premium spice mixes. Mostly I freshly grind whole spices to make my own masala. Also I only use fresh vegetables and quality fresh meat or fish. That for me is the buzz to actually not just recreate BIR tasting food but to top it by using better, fresher and healthier ingredients. That is the great thing about this site it allows people to grasp the basics then move on to higher levels to perfect the standard dishes to their own taste or to actually create entirely new dishes of their own.

Bon article

[Stephen Lindsay]

I agree with what's been said so far - I think the article is over simplistic because it tars all Indian restaurants with the same brush, except his of course and the article is quite a subtle advertisement for his own place. Since he spent so much time talking about late night revellers trashing the place I imagine his view must have been tainted by seeing his father being treated with so much disrespect.

Great article though, and other Indian chefs like Atul Kochhar are also upping the standard of restaurants serving Indian food.

[chewytikka]

Hi George
Are you talking about food that you actually cook, or food you buy in restaurants?

Hi lads
I agree with most of the comments so far,
Aktar Islam I remember this guy on the F word, getting up Gordon Ramsey's back as he was such an arrogant shite. (I'd love to see the out takes of that show.)
i think he has done a good job, in self promotion. But hopefully he won't succeed in becoming a full blown celebrity chef as he's
not in the same league as Cyrus Todiwala and Atul Kochhar, chefs I admire very much.
cheers Chewy

[Cory Ander]

If very, very tasty, relatively cheap, high quality (i.e. value for money) high street BIR food is considered to be "junk" (or "fast") food , then, yes, that is the what I personally wish to replicate.

It seems, to me, to be a bit like wishing to replicate a KFC (or McDonald's Big Mac, Hungry Jacks' Whopper, Steer's spare ribs, Nandos chicken, etc) and saying that you should rather be wishing to eat some far more expensive alternative.  The latter is fine (if that's what you prefer) but I am after the former.

Having said that, if I owned an Indian restaurant, I would definitely diversify/differentiate into something altogether more traditional, bespoke, freshly made, low volume and.....far more expensive! God rue the day.....

In fact, I have recommended such an approach, to an Indian restaurateur, in the 90s (including belly dancers 'n all).  Thankfully (but for him?) he ignored me and opened yet another typical BIR restaurant.... :

[imustbedreamin]

sounds to me like he has a chip on his shoulder

[buddy]

A very arrogant article.
Rather than publicly demean his father, he should fall on his knees in thanks for the opportunity his father provided through his selfless, hard work.
His father and that pioneering generation and possibly second generation introduced the UK to relatively inexpensive dining out, prior to Indian restaurants very few people ate out other than simple cafes with very simple menus.
They also opened a new and exciting adventure to the British public and that was, food prepared with spices,herbs and ingredients never previously experienced or even dreamt of.
As with all cuisine, Indian food is evolving often in my view to pander to the narcissist artistic egos of modern cooks
I like a nice traditional curry not a work of art on the plate and pay through the nose for the privilege

[George]

As you are no longer interested in average BIR fare, does this site now not supply you with what you are looking for?

Yes, I'm now longer interested in the 2011 average level of BIR fare because I feel that it's no longer as tasty as the average standard in the BIRs of the 1980s and 90s. I continue to rate this forum highly because of the good contributions made on threads like this one, for example. I also rate many of the recipes. Blade's tikka recipe is a good example. It's only in above average BIRs that you might get tikka as good as that. Too often you're given dried out, tasteless morsels, possibly reheated from the day before. As I think I mentioned, a long term favourite BIR of mine has now slipped from above average (fine tasting food) to average (food which doesn't taste very special). It's nothing to do with the base sauce approach. They would always have used base sauces.