Topic: India Raj - North Town Aldershot - Curry Sauce

[parker21]

hi solar sorry for not replying sooner, the debris in the base could come from a  spice/garlic/tom puree tarka, this is the method told to me by the chef at mouchak, it could also be debris from curry dish making, non-cleaned spoon. having tasted bases in 3 kitchens i know what you mean by the moorishness. if i ever have any vindaloo sauce left from a takeaway from mouchak i add it to  my finished dish and then it smells the kitchen out  just like being in the mouchak kitchen or my car on the 5 mile journey home yum!
hope this helps
regards
gary

[solarsplace]

hi solar sorry for not replying sooner, the debris in the base could come from a  spice/garlic/tom puree tarka, this is the method told to me by the chef at mouchak, it could also be debris from curry dish making, non-cleaned spoon. having tasted bases in 3 kitchens i know what you mean by the moorishness. if i ever have any vindaloo sauce left from a takeaway from mouchak i add it to  my finished dish and then it smells the kitchen out  just like being in the mouchak kitchen or my car on the 5 mile journey home yum!
hope this helps
regards
gary

Hi Gary

Reply very much appreciated, and very interesting!

Having obtained this curry sauce twice now, I get the feeling the particles / slithers for want of a better word are deliberate. I look into what you said though!

Regards  ;D

[Derek Dansak]

the real bir base i once purchased and cooked with, did nothing to lead me closer to the taste. My curries tasted much the same as normal. i can only conclude all real bir bases are very different beasts. this supports my theory that all bir chefs arrive at a different style of cooking by there own trials and errors and skill.  I remember the chef at my local described 2 process when making base. 1) was adding the chicken stock from the pre cooking of chicken. 2) was making a tom puree and oil and garlic fried paste (with other spices i expect)  then adding this to the boiled onion at a later stage. He said it was very important.  Its a bit like the method when making a kd1 base, where you add the tomato towards the middle of base cooking.  I always adopt this approach of making the base in 2 parts , before a final slow simmer. it is important and helps improve the final curry massively.

[Peripatetic Phil]

Its a bit like the method when making a kd1 base, where you add the tomato towards the middle of base cooking.  I always adopt this approach of making the base in 2 parts , before a final slow simmer. it is important and helps improve the final curry massively.

I found it quite interesting to learn from KD2 (New Curry Secret) that Kris now says that the tomato, turmeric, paprika, etc. can be added pre-blending if one does not mind one's blender getting spice-stained ("If you want to speed things up ..., simply add the spices, tomato paste and canned tomatoes to the onions ... just before adding the water").

I haven't tried this, of course, not wanting to end up with a spice-stained blender and an irate wife !

** Phil.

[Derek Dansak]

i wouldnt listen to much to kds opinions. cr0 members know alot more. for a start adding tomato or tomato puree to early can lead to sour taste in base. I always add tomato puree or tomato late in base making process. as advised by a real bir chef. 2ndly adding spices early is not my favoured apprach, i prefer to let the onions cook in the oil for 40 minutes with garlic etc, then add spices. this avoids spices losing flavour from too much boiling in water. it often weakens the spice flavour in a bad way. I aim for a rich orange base, by adding tumeric and paprika quite late. they need about 30 mins on slow simmer to release the flavour.  I dont add these at the start ever. Just my opinions from 4 years of experimenting. kd also over does the ginger and onion amounts. too much onion leads to a sickly taste in a base. this took me a year to realise. reduce the onion and add some green pepper. this creates a dark flavour in a the base , and makes for an interesting final curry.

[Peripatetic Phil]

i wouldnt listen to much to kds opinions. cr0 members know alot more.

I don't dispute that, collectively or individually, we may well know as much as Kris Dhillon, but I would be very surprised if we knew more, since we lack her heritage.

for a start adding tomato or tomato puree to early can lead to sour taste in base. I always add tomato puree or tomato late in base making process. as advised by a real bir chef. 2ndly adding spices early is not my favoured apprach, i prefer to let the onions cook in the oil for 40 minutes with garlic etc, then add spices. this avoids spices losing flavour from too much boiling in water. it often weakens the spice flavour in a bad way. I aim for a rich orange base, by adding tumeric and paprika quite late. they need about 30 mins on slow simmer to release the flavour.  I dont add these at the start ever. Just my opinions from 4 years of experimenting. kd also over does the ginger and onion amounts. too much onion leads to a sickly taste in a base. this took me a year to realise. reduce the onion and add some green pepper. this creates a dark flavour in a the base , and makes for an interesting final curry.

These are all interesting observations, and I thank you for publishing them; I shall certainly bear them in mind when making my next batch of base.
** Phil.

[Derek Dansak]

glad to be of help phil . if you dont yet feel cr0 offers more info than a kd book, i think you have not dug deep enough into cr0 huge library of info. I must admit its overwhelming , but collectively there is enough info here to produce curries 3 times as good as any found in the pages of a kd book. or any bir cookery book i know of. The members on this forum go into a much finer detail of the art of bir cookery. KD books are not aimed at this type of audience. they are really for novices. for that purpose they are good books well worth buying. 

[Peripatetic Phil]

if you dont yet feel cr0 offers more info than a kd book, i think you have not dug deep enough into cr0 huge library of info.

Ah, clearly a misunderstanding here : I was not suggesting that there is not far more to be found here on CR0 than in any KD book; I am certain that there is.  What I was suggesting is that we, both as individuals and collectively, are unlikely to know more than Kris herself, simply because we do not have the benefit of her Punjabi heritage.

** Phil.

[Derek Dansak]

Phil i really have to disagree. i purchased her original book and made many curries, none came close to bir. in fact they tasted rather odd. When i compared them to some of the wonderful traditional indian recipes i was making at the time (from other books) i concluded kris dillon had no real mastery of the art of bir cooking. If someone writes a book on a subject and it does not deliver the goods, it is a strong indication that their underlying knowledge is lacking. Surely someone with a long heritage behind them would have no problem writing a book which at least manages to replicate a few key bir dishes eg madras, or rogan josh or tikka masalla. all of these recipes from the original book were nothing like a real bir dish. So i am unclear why you feel she has some long heritage of bir cookery knowledge. I am of the opinion kris is more of a business women/author/casual cook, with links in the cookery business. The kd books are a clever money spinner, but i see little evidence of a wealth of heritage and cooking knowledge passed through generations. Even the kd base needs modifying to become acceptable.  I would be more forgiving if just one recipe in that book stood the test of time. but alas on closer inspection none of those recipes are special , and part of my favourite repetoire.  Explain what you mean by punjabi heritage? do you mean cooking knowlege ? where is the evidence of this cookery knowledge kris has from this heritage?

[PaulP]

A big problem with the KD1 book is the use of her garam masala as the main spice mix for most of the curries.

I don't think you would ever get close to BIR if you followed her recipes to the letter.

Paul