Topic: we have cracked it.

[JerryM]

moonster,

well pleased for you. i was at my local TA last night and must admit the only thing that really caught me eye (well always does) is the chefs burner.

not being negative in anyway but i'm surprised that 3.5kw does it. my stove was initially 2.5kw. i then switched hob to gas which is 3.0kw. neither did it. my stove at max is ~9kw but i don't have it at full wack - i'd say pretty close though - say something like 7kw. i do turn the heat down for CTM and the like but it's impossible to tell to what kw value.

do you get a lot of smoke and mess - i've had to move cooking into the garage.

[moonster]

Hi jerry,

9kw wow. wouldnt want to pay your gas bill  ;D

i have went from a conventional cooker to what now seems like a beast in comparison to what i have had before.

 i also mentioned i use a cast iron wok which retains the heat like nothing i have used before so could be a combination of both.

it does spit up the sides but because its a deep wok i get very little mess onto the hob. (mrs moony may disagree with the previous comment though ;D).

regards

Alan ;D

[Gazza63]

I'm sorry but I am not convniced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant  as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in  the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good)  how many reciopes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why? 

[Panpot]

Moonster great post and although Jerry sets the standard with his fantastic burner and great method you will get very good results with what you are doing. Heat is vital and curry is cooked very quickly both in TAs and BIRs. Seperatly I can't thank you enough for the kitchen site. I am moving to Canterbury in January and we are considering a new kitchen so your advice is invaluable. Can you share the cooker you have chosen and any further advise about taken advantage of the sites prices and quality when like me I am hopeless at DIY. If anyone else in the aera can recommend a fitter that would be cool. Thanks PP

[Graeme]

This is taken from http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2815.0

This from the man himself and he talks about high temperature.

Sorry i don't know ho to do  on here but by the magic of copy and paste
some of what he wrote is below...
Phil, Chaa006 thank you very much for the info you sent me  I can now do "quotes"

As you know I have been in discussion with Bruce Edwards and he has kindly provided CR0.co.uk with an article on the restaurant Curry Sauce and Basic Curry.  So here it is.......

Bruce Edwards
I discovered this forum about a year after it first came online, and have visited it from time to time since then. Initially progress seemed slow, then people started reporting on kitchen demos, and things started to get interesting. Very soon there was some good information, but also a lot that wasn't helpful, and some - well I wont say any more. The difficulty for many people was just what to believe Common problems are that when someone sees for the first time what goes on in a restaurant kitchen they're are in an unfamiliar environment, their observations are often unreliable and they often misinterpret what they have seen. They might see a pan on the cooker on a burner that resembles a rocket engine and so conclude that a high temperature and lots of heat are necessary, but they fail to notice that the contents of the pan are only simmering, because it is a small pan and most of the heat is going up the side. The chef then takes the opportunity to impress the visitor by producing a sheet of flame with a flick of his spoon and a shake of the pan, and the impression is reinforced.

Another example is quantities; the visitor sees a massive pot of sauce on the cooker and asks how much coriander/turmeric/cumin etc. he needs in his pot which is 'this' big. The chef, trying to be helpful, makes a guess. Now think about it. If your pot is 6 inches in diameter and the same in depth, and the restaurant one is three times this, [distinctly possible] then the restaurant one actually contains TWENTY SEVEN times the volume of yours, as simple   arithmetic will show, but a fact that might easily be overlooked.
People look for recipes with a definite result in mind. And while recipes are obviously important and have a part to play, what BIR cooking is really all about is using Traditional Indian methods and spices to cook dishes that are not typically 'Indian'.

When everything is right, the Restaurant Flavour/Smell is produced, almost as a by-product of the process as a whole. Of course the chef will have heard of this, but probably wont be too clear about what we actually mean by it. He will almost certainly assume that we are talking about general spiciness. Only a true British Curry Enthusiast can fully appreciate it.

[moonster]

pp,

I went with the CDA range on cooker, hob,extractor, fridge, freezer and sink and taps. i went with the silver five burner hob at ?191 and the 8 function oven. (and they offer 10% discount on all appliances).

advice would be to go for the high range doors as the difference in price between the low range and the high range for example would cost an extra ?300 for a kitchen containing 20 doors.

regardless of what kitchen you order the quality of the carcasses will always be the same.

cheekily go for the one man delivery at ?75 like i did. two men turn up anyway ;D.

I also agree with graeme in that ultimate heat is not the answer and that is not what i am trying to say because i dont even use my wok burner to full capacity.

 I do believe however that since i have used the wok burner that my results have significantly produced better results than my favourate restraunt.

I also must point out that i am not saying i have cracked it for everyone on this forum and that i have only cracked it for ourselves as we have far surpassed what we have achieved before.

I have got to say though that out of everything i have tried for the past 10-15 years (believe me i have tried everything ) my eureka moment came from replicating the excellent recipes on this forum as i have done so many times but this time at the higher intensity heat and also halving the cooking time has had the single biggest impact on achieving what i percieve as a BIR curry.

hope my feedback helps

Alan ;D

[JerryM]

I'm sorry but I am not convinced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant  as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in  the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good)  how many recipes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why?

ThaiExpat,

what you say is exactly right. i cook the curry in 5 mins on full right through (something like 30 sec g/g, 60 sec spices). with this heat the skill is in the early stages in not overcooking or burning. i don't see any difference in taste upto the end of the spice stage. i don't know enough about why the heat works but gut feeling is that the heat is not needed at the g/g and spice stages. for me i see the difference between low say 3 kw and high say 7 kw when the 1st chef spoon goes into the spices. i think water "thin" base is also a factor and believe the oil and water burns somehow.

this is the link to my exploits http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0. i've now had something like 12 mths of further practise cooking in the garage - since my last post and feel very comfortable and happy.

clearly it's not for everyone - believe me if you can cook in your kitchen then you are not cooking at the same temperature as i do. watch the extract in your local TA.

moonster,

i am working on pizza at the moment and the idea of a heat mass "pizza stone" has cropped up there. i'm hopefully trying out today myself. in terms of curry i can see it working in this application too and making the difference you report. best wishes.

[emin-j]

I'm sorry but I am not convinced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant  as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in  the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good)  how many recipes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why?

ThaiExpat,

what you say is exactly right. i cook the curry in 5 mins on full right through (something like 30 sec g/g, 60 sec spices). with this heat the skill is in the early stages in not overcooking or burning. i don't see any difference in taste upto the end of the spice stage. i don't know enough about why the heat works but gut feeling is that the heat is not needed at the g/g and spice stages. for me i see the difference between low say 3 kw and high say 7 kw when the 1st chef spoon goes into the spices. i think water "thin" base is also a factor and believe the oil and water burns somehow.

this is the link to my exploits http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0. i've now had something like 12 mths of further practise cooking in the garage - since my last post and feel very comfortable and happy.

clearly it's not for everyone - believe me if you can cook in your kitchen then you are not cooking at the same temperature as i do. watch the extract in your local TA.

moonster,

i am working on pizza at the moment and the idea of a heat mass "pizza stone" has cropped up there. i'm hopefully trying out today myself. in terms of curry i can see it working in this application too and making the difference you report. best wishes.

JerryM ,
Interesting post , I know you have been a fan of ' High temperature cooking ' and your mention of the difference in taste seems to be once the first spoon of Base goes in had me thinking back to my comments on your Madras post.
What if the spoon of Base you are adding which is basically liquidized boiled Onions are then subjected to extreme heat would fry / caramalize the Onion in the Base to give this ' special ' flavour that moonster has found and maybe the missing 5% we are missing 

[moonster]

eminj,

I think you have hit the nail firmly on the head mate, thanks for working that out for me. ;D

I just put it down to the extra heat without thinking why. 

when i look back there was definatley caramalisation going on when i added the base, that is why i had to keep adding the base continuously rather than waiting for the oil to rise to the surface.

thanks

Alan ;D

[haldi]

You don't need high heat to make a BIR curry
I've seen them prepared with high heat, and low heat
It doesn't affect the outcome
I thought it did, that's why I bought a BIR catering cooker
Believe me, it made no difference
It just gives speed and the ability to incinerate everything