Topic: That unatainable taste

[CaliforniaTaffy]

I met my first curry back in a small town in Wales back in in 1963, Ha, the Beatles, everything seemed simpler back then.
The first Pakistani restaurant (The Bagladesh) in Merthyr Tydfil , Wales, was a great new experience for me, a 17 year old apprentice stonemason and his best pal.
I remember going there after the last call at the pub (used to be 10:00 pm) and every Friday night challenging other inexperienced assorted work buddies telling them they couldn't dare eat a Vindaloo curry, remember, they didn't even know what a curry was.

Well their beer induced pride got the better of them and it ended up as a bet, if they couldn't eat the same curry as we ordered, they will foot the bill, if they could eat it, we would pay up.
By now I was friendly with the waiter and would wink to him as I ordered for our table, he winked back, he knew the preordained sign and ordered a normal Vindaloo for me and my accomplice and a triple Vindaloo for our unsuspecting guests, by the way, the chefs always enjoyed watching our victims suffer, peeking around from the kitchen door.

The triple Vindaloo had 3 times the hot of a normal Vindaloo and you can probably guess the result, after 1/2 hour of nose runs, eye watering and the occasional sob they gave up and paid the bill.
OK we were charlatans, tricksters if you will, but we were 17 year old apprentices earning 2 pounds, 50 shillings a week and they earned 4 times our pay.  I don't have any guilt, I figure they were just happy to be introduced to something other than a fish and chip night, so there.

The chef was a friendly man and walked me around the kitchen one mid week night.
I only remember the huge pot of simmering base.
He put a ladle into it and I saw the familiar red oil floating on top, mix downward with the yellow cats eye colored mixture below.

I live in beautiful California now, the (not top class, just local) Indian restaurants I have ate at and talked with the owners, just add more curry powder to make different curry, (i.e) 2 tsp of powder for a Korma= 3 for a Madras= get the idea!
They say the American customers don't know the difference, they are probably right, but I cook curry my own for our family at least twice a week, my family are getting to be curry experts.

I am a ex-patriot curry head and have tried to make that same Vindaloo curry taste all of the rest of my life, but have never got close until I tried this:

I medium chopped 4 yellow onions, put them in peanut or grapeseed oil and caramelized them until they melt (whole pieces, no blender, that just makes a onion puree and no oil) and then all is left is the onion oil (not a lot at a time or they will just boil) and just kept taking the onion oil out and adding more onions to the pan until they melted away (be patient with very low heat) and I ended up with a whole 1/4 pint of onion oil, this will probably take 3-4 hours, you can adjust the amount of onions just to to test.
I added the usual generic base to a curry and added 5 Tbls of the onion oil, it gave me the old taste I remember, it may not work for you, but I don't see this in any other posts, maybe this is the taste you old guys remember, or maybe??

I am getting ready to make a homemade tandoor oven as the websites show out there.

I live in Somis, California, my business website is www.venturacaststone.com

[matt3333]

Nice post Taffy
I'm sure that with the information on this site you will soon be producing  top notch curries.
Matt

[Secret Santa]

added 5 Tbls of the onion oil, it gave me the old taste I remember

Hi CT

Well flavoured/spiced oils are being discussed quite often at the moment. The bunjarra seems to be quite common which is a fried mix of onion/tomato/spices.

The oil only thing you suggest is new though I think? I've used well cooked onions as a puree complete with the oil, and while I liked the added flavour it didn't give me that BIR taste I was after. I think I'll try the oil only though as it can't do any harm and might just do some good.

[Panpot]

Hi Taffy, I loved your post, thanks for taking the time to let us in on your approach. I have been away from the site for some time and only this past weekend came back on to get my recipe for Bunjarra and other critical components for a Glasgow tasting curry. It was the sixties when I first had a go with a curry too. I got the recipe for this particular onion paste full of oil from one of the best restaurants in Scotland and by the Chef himself. It is the critical and missing ingredient that I was searching for for over 30 years. Many on the site poo poo  the idea of the paste and have only confirmed my long held belief that there is significant regional variation in curry up and down the UK. This is down to the background of the chefs and owners. So If back then in Wales the chef came from the same part of the Indian sub Continent then the good chance is we were tasting similar food. I was not surprised by your onion oil and absolutely know that it will make the difference. Bye the way God help all those nationalities who never taste the real thing. I have travelled extensively and nowhere can put out a curry on the table like Glasgow and maybe from what you have described Wales too. good luck to you and enjoy the site though it can become a distraction to life, that's why I now have to go easy on my visits. Cheers Panpot

[Derek Dansak]

there is only one test for me. does it release the strong odour of real bir curry. If not then it does not pass the acid test. the real bir flavour i am after smells like nothing I know. The car stinks of takeaway. if i put my curry in my car in a silver container it would not smell anything like this.  (not that i tried lol  ;D )  Down the south of england they reprodue this taste in 1 of 3 curry houses. less so in london, where i can match the typical takeaway taste.

[gazman1976]

Glasgow !!!

[Panpot]

Derek, I have struggled with the smell thing too. I believe it is impossible to truly taste and smell a curry if you have cooked it. The chefs at The Ashoka confirmed this as our taste buds and seems of smell Gets quickly acclimatised as we prepare and cook the stuff. I ask my wife or guests especially those  arriving form outside and they claim that my Ashoka efforts are spot on. They are certainly the best I have tasted outside a curry house in over thirty years of searching and cooking the stuff.

[Derek Dansak]

Hi Panpot, i have made the ashoka korai bhuna over 50 times !! so i need no pursuading on its quality. In fact i am making some new ashoka base as we speak ! In london i find many good bir that dont have any special smell, and are similar to ashoka and the glasgow type taste. its strong tasting, concentrated, and dark, and rich. However in the south of england they do it very differently. Its very light, sweet , and lightly spiced gravy sauce. It has a certain aroma.  The ashoka kit is spot on at reproducing the london and glasgow curries. hopefully one day we will gain more insight into replicating the south east taste. I know this is the taste the forum is most concerned with. Maybe its just a different style of preparation we are not privy too. I doubt its a missing ingredient, but a missing process.  Hey its a shame the southern bir chefs are not so open as the ashoka chefs !  cheers DD

[Panpot]

Thanks Derek, I would be grateful for you suggesting what I might order next time I eat out to experience what you are talking about. I live in the Rye area of East Sussex and would enjoy being part of the quest for what you guys are looking for.

[CaliforniaTaffy]

Panpot, and everyone else, thanks for the reply.
I am sure that what I was looking at in the large pot in the Pakistani Restaurant kitchen was mostly onion oil floating on top of the base.
It smelled of onions and I did reproduce that smell and color and the final taste in the curry's I make, again, I let the chopped onions fry down to nothing and didn't puree them, pureeing adds air to the oil and it seems to taste completely different after cooking, and pureeing the onions before frying doesn't let the onions fry to that red color, they just boil in their own liquid.
Reducing the chopped onions down to liquid produces a red oil which also gives the curry a red color, and that great look of the separated oil floating on top.
I am going to  try adding it to the base as a regular base ingredient, it just takes so long to reduce down, but I think it is worth the time.