Topic: Curry Base and Madras Recipes (from Spice as Nice)

[Spice-as-Nice]

This thread was originally about people interested in cooking at this BIR.  I have moved any posts about this to a new thread here:  http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4056.msg36760#msg36760  The remainder of this thread is now about the recipes arising from the discussions.  I hope separating the two topics makes things clearer for all - CA

Hi all.

I had a lengthy chat with the owner of my local curry takeaway after he invited me "round the back".....

.....The base =
Onions Boiled in a pan 2ft across and 1ft deep , for 2 hours
Nothing else added.
After boiling
4 chefs spoons of chilli powder ( in my opinion on the spoon it would be 2.5 cups total qty )
4 chefs spoons of salt
1 chefs spoons of tomato puree
4 chefs spoons of oil
After this is added blend with blender
Bring back to boil , simer for 1/2 to 1 hour.
Let cool , oil will come to top , scoop off and discard ( its thrown away )

Nothing else is in it, no ginger , no garlic , nothing , i sepecificly asked " is there anything else added ? " . He said "no". I aksed about carrots , he said " no , it would be too sweet . If we put carrots in we would have to use more salt"

To make the basic medium house curry ( he made this for me , I was 2 ft away from the gas ring )

Four chefs spoons of the curry base were put in pan.
Brought to boil.
Pre-cooked chicken added from bubbling pan on next ring. He told me small amount of Haldi and chilli was in with the bubbling chicken. It didn't look heavily coloured. Just looked like water with maybe 1 or 2 teaspoons of each in the water. I would say there was enough chicken for 6 or maybe 10 curries.
After boiling this lot ( note : I would say it was boiling rather than frying ) for about 3 minutes , part chefs spoon of Cumin added ( maybe about 2 teaspoons ) . same Powdered Coriander . 1 large pinch ( maybe a teaspoon ) of dried Methi.
It all looked nice an sandy coloured ( mid range to light brown ).
He asked " do I want it yellower" . I said no it looks fine.
He asked " do you want it redder " . I said no it looks fine.
He continued on a high boil for 2 to 3 minutes , then put it in the plastic tub , he emptied out of the corner of the pot any excess oil ( it went down the sink ) sprinkled a pinch of chopped Coriander leaves in and put the lid on . Done.

I asked " no garlic no ginger" he said " add garlic if you want, we do if they ask for it. we do do garlic curries and we do add ginger in some types"
I asked about other things too like Cumin , Ajwain , Cassia , Cinnamon and others , he said yes sometimes but in very small amounts.
His advice was keep it simple, don't add to many different spices, they will not improve flavour , they will just alter it and mask other spices or make it too intense. I asked about his HOT-ROD cooking ring . " do you need all that heat ? " He said "NO, it's just for speed , we have to be quick. I asked " could I make the same curry at home on my normal gas ring ? " he said " yes , it makes no difference , you can make it at home exactly the same". I asked about oil and does he save it or reuse it . He said no , they never save oil , they try to make curries with less oil now , viewpoints have changed . I asked have peoples tastes changed with regards to oil . He said not as far as he knows because they are selling more curries now , even though they have less oil in them but if someone askes for an oily curry , they can have one.  He said extra oil adds nothing to the curry as far as taste goes , it still tastes the same.

Now, on eating at home , it wasn't the best curry I have had from there , but it was a bog standard average nice medium curry. For my taste , a little lacking in oil , but strangly there was some red oil on the top by the time I got home and ate it but not much.
It slightly lacked colour for my preference.
I think he normally adds a few more bits for my usual order but keep in mind this was his demo to me of how easy it is put together. 

Hope all this is usefull knowledge for anyone whos interested.

Keep the faith.

[joshallen2k]

Hi Spice-as-Nice,

Great find. Could you elaborate on what he said? What went (and didn't go) into the base and curry?

And most importantly, was the curry any good? (i.e. did it have the "taste" we are looking for)

Cheers,
Josh

[PaulP]

Thanks for the post Spice-As-Nice.

It does make me think that some of the base recipes on here might be too complex - in my opinion the onions are probably the most important ingredient of a base towards creating a final tasty curry sauce.

[Spice-as-Nice]

Thanks for the post Spice-As-Nice.

If it was a bit closer I would consider coming to the demo too. Hopefully somebody else will take up your offer.

It does make me think that some of the base recipes on here might be too complex - in my opinion the onions are probably the most important ingredient of a base towards creating a final tasty curry sauce.

I forgot to mention ... I also bought a container of just the curry sauce ( not base ). This he did seperate in another pan.  ( my intention on this is to have a play with it at home one day ). I tasted just a teaspoon full and kept in mind my watching him a 1/2 hour earlier. he put very little in it . Just Curry base , and then only 2 other powdered spices ( he was quick and lots happening in the shop but I beleive it was again Coriander and a much smaller amount of Cumin + dried methi ). Again , I would describe it more like boiling than frying. Having said that , I have watched them before over the counter and they do fry in oil cos iv'e seen it but it's not been much oil.
While all this was cooking of mine he was also cooking for deliveries. he did a spinnach and potato and what looked like a lamb madras. he was making pitza bases too. Yet in all this he had tome to stand and talk to me, easy style !

Oh yes , and the price , what i bougth was:

1/the chicken curry he cooked for me
2/ a container of curry gravy without any meat
3/ 10 Chipatti's ( I ate 2 and freeze the others )

total cost GBP = 8.40     ( Eight Pounds and 40p )  date : 9/12/2009 . time approx 8pm.

[JerryM]

Spice As Nice,

quite a mind challenging report. the owner is a real star for sure.

i do know how good a simple base like u describe is - takes u by surprise.

for me the video isn't important - your words are enough.

will be real interesting how u get on - particularly if u can build a long term relationship and maybe persuade him to join us all.

there are a few things i'd struggle on adopting but clearly your man relies on his food for his living.

i keep trying to think of what question i would ask a chef if i had just one go. i think it would be on mix powder & spice - how do they vary the spice across dishes. it sounds as if he does not use mix powder?

[joshallen2k]

Spice-as-Nice,

Very interesting read. Two teaspoons each of cumin and coriander in the final curry would be consistent with a lightly spiced base. As for the chicken curry recipe, I suppose one could add some tomato paste, chilli, and a little lemon juice to make it a Madras.

I was going to have a go at scaling down the recipe to fit in a domestic size pot. Once I started that, I was wondering about the size of the chef's spoon. You mentioned that 4 chef's spoons seemed to be about 2.5 cups. Are you sure? Or is that the total estimated volume for the chilli, salt, tomato and oil?

Great stuff. As Jerry suggests, if he is as accommodating as he seems, ask him to join cr0!

-- Josh

[Secret Santa]

i keep trying to think of what question i would ask a chef if i had just one go. i think it would be on mix powder & spice - how do they vary the spice across dishes.

I think the answer for the majority of BIRs is that the spices don't vary across the dishes, which is why most BIR dishes are very samey. It used to be that when I went for a curry there was a very distinct difference between each dish, that doesn't seem to be the case now.

They seem to rely on the other ingredients in the dish to make the difference, but I think the vast majority use mix powder to different degrees.

[Spice-as-Nice]

Spice-as-Nice,

Very interesting read. Two teaspoons each of cumin and coriander in the final curry would be consistent with a lightly spiced base. As for the chicken curry recipe, I suppose one could add some tomato paste, chilli, and a little lemon juice to make it a Madras.

I was going to have a go at scaling down the recipe to fit in a domestic size pot. Once I started that, I was wondering about the size of the chef's spoon. You mentioned that 4 chef's spoons seemed to be about 2.5 cups. Are you sure? Or is that the total estimated volume for the chilli, salt, tomato and oil?

Great stuff. As Jerry suggests, if he is as accommodating as he seems, ask him to join cr0!

I'd love to join you at the restaurant, but alas, I am many thousands of miles away from Yorkshire!

-- Josh

The total volume of the chefs spoon was 4 of them = 2.5 cups ( thats a fine china cup or as we would describe as a lady's cup )

[joshallen2k]

So is a "lady's cup" or a "china cup" the same as a "cup" used in cooking? (i.e. 250ml)

[JerryM]

Secret Santa,

many thanks. i'm searching for gaps and given what u say put's my mind at rest.

ps josh my chef spoon is 4 tbsp (giving 240ml). our china cup measures 200ml so in the right ball park.