I was interested to read the statement "never thaw meat at room temperature on the kitchen counter" on this page http://www.irishbeef.co.uk/top-tips/

Not sure what to make of that. The immediate question is - why not?  I've always thawed frozen meat in this way!

Ps their recipes section is worth a look

Quote from: natterjak on October 18, 2011, 10:30 AM
I was interested to read the statement "never thaw meat at room temperature on the kitchen counter" on this page http://www.irishbeef.co.uk/top-tips/  Not sure what to make of that. The immediate question is - why not?  I've always thawed frozen meat in this way!

The problem is, the advice consists of two independent parts  in juxtaposition :

• Never thaw meat at room temperature
• Never thaw meat on the kitchen counter.

and it is not at all clear what the juxtaposing is intended to convey.  Is it, for example, all right to "thaw meat at room temperature on the loo floor" ?, and if so, why is this better than than doing so on the kitchen counter ?!  Alternatively, if I temporarily put a patio heater in my kitchen (or turns the oven on to max. and open the oven door) is it OK to "thaw meat at much higher than normal room temperature on the kitchen counter." ?

I'm sure the advice is well-meant, and maybe even based on sound scientific advice, but unless it is clarified it will just enter my personal list of well-meant advice to be ignored.

** Phil.

Quote from: natterjak on October 18, 2011, 10:30 AMThe immediate question is - why not?  I've always thawed frozen meat in this way!

Hey Natterjak

You should thaw frozen meat in the fridge, so it's constantly kept at a temperature (34 to 40 degrees C) that doesn't allow bacteria to become active. Freezing meat merely makes bacteria dormant, once the temperature rises, they can become active again.

Cheers and good Karma!

Quote from: spiceyokooko on November 04, 2011, 04:00 PM
You should thaw frozen meat in the fridge, so it's constantly kept at a temperature (34 to 40 degrees C)

Er, 34 to 40 degrees F perhaps ?!
** Phil.

Quote from: Phil (Chaa006) on November 04, 2011, 04:50 PMEr, 34 to 40 degrees F perhaps ?!

Um, whoops yes!

Thanks for the correction!

Cheers and good Karma!

Quote from: spiceyokooko on November 04, 2011, 04:00 PM

Quote from: natterjak on October 18, 2011, 10:30 AMThe immediate question is - why not?  I've always thawed frozen meat in this way!

Hey Natterjak

You should thaw frozen meat in the fridge, so it's constantly kept at a temperature (34 to 40 degrees C) that doesn't allow bacteria to become active. Freezing meat merely makes bacteria dormant, once the temperature rises, they can become active again.

Cheers and good Karma!

Hi Sok. Thanks for your reply. I appreciate the difference between room temp and fridge temp but my point is the meat would only rise to room temp After it defrosts. So this doesn't seem to bE a reason not to defrost at room temp And subsequently pit into the fridge.

I usually defrost chicken in a bowl of water, if I'm in a hurry....never had any problems.

Quote from: natterjak on November 05, 2011, 10:18 AM
[T]he meat would only rise to room temp After it defrosts.

This would be true only if meat were a perfect conductor, which of course it is not (nothing is).  By definition there will be local variation in the temperature, with the outside typically being considerably warmer than the core (which will be the last part to defrost).  So from the perspective of physics, at least, there is a risk that the outside will reach a temperature at which bacteria can rapidly multiply while the inside may still be frozen solid.  And thus from the perspective of health, there is an increased risk of food poisoning if one defrosts at room temperature (particularly in a warm room such as a kitchen with Aga or Rayburn) than if one defrosts in the 'fridge.  That said, I frequently defrost in the microwave oven overnight (turned off, just used as meat safe) and have yet to suffer any ill effects.  I would /not/ defrost shellfish at ambient, however : either in very cold water, or in the 'fridge.

** Phil.

Thanks Phil. I have a feeling I'm going to have to run a test with a pair of digital thermometers, one in the centre of the meat and one to the outside. My unproven hypothesis is that for a "normal" size joint of meat, the outside won't rise above fridge temperature until the core defrosts but it might be fun to test this. 

Quote from: natterjak on November 05, 2011, 10:18 AMHi Sok. Thanks for your reply. I appreciate the difference between room temp and fridge temp but my point is the meat would only rise to room temp After it defrosts. So this doesn't seem to bE a reason not to defrost at room temp And subsequently pit into the fridge.

Hey Natterjack!

The problem is, as I mentioned, the bacteria in/on frozen meat become dormant when it's frozen, as soon as the temperature begins to rise, as it would on a piece of meat defrosting in the kitchen, they become active again. You then put the meat back in the fridge and those bacteria are now active on the meat and will make it go off faster within the fridge than if you'd not allowed them to become active!

Defrosting frozen meat in the fridge does not raise the temperature on or around meat at any point that allows the dormant bacteria to become active and therefore the meat will (should?) last longer in the fridge before going off.

Cheers and good Karma!