Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: George on January 01, 2008, 05:18 PM
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I just found this:
http://www.thecurrybook.com
Again, as with all these sites, auctions and what have you, they all make out it's the real deal. Thjey all know what we're looking for, but it seems that 99% disappoint with the delivery, and may be just out to make money, starting with Pat Chapman. At least the Kushi Balti people told us the name and address of their restaurant, even if the recipes were not the great breakthrough we are looking for.
Regards
George
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Did you know this is Andy, from the RCR site?
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What a surprise. I did wonder if it was genuine, as there is no mention of who the authors are or what the name of the restaurant is.
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Did you know this is Andy, from the RCR site?
Ah, that may explain it then! I have my views but had beter keep them to myself, unless given full clearance to speak our minds.
Regards
George
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Hey guys, what's happening?
Is this book written by a member of another forum then?
Is it just another scam?
Has anyone read the ebook or looked at the recipes?
Is it worth getting?
... or is everything about this ebook not a topic of discussion on this forum ???
More info please ...
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Hey guys, what's happening?
Is this book written by a member of another forum then?
Is it just another scam?
Has anyone read the ebook or looked at the recipes?
Is it worth getting?
... or is everything about this ebook not a topic of discussion on this forum ???
More info please ...
I don't know what the content of this book is, but I believe it will contain extracts from the Real Curry Recipe website
This is run by a chap called Andy who originally posted on this site
Check out the "ten year" recipes here
There was a degree of doubt over the facts that he posted
He said he had worked in a restaurant for ten years and was sharing the recipes from that place.
However, a lot of the information seemed copied almost word for word from a previous curry article, already on the net by someone called "M"
This whole issue became a splitting point
Some people went to the other side
Some stayed here
Some check both
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... or is everything about this ebook not a topic of discussion on this forum ???
I think that's the general idea, purely because we don't want to give the edited for inappropriate language by CA free advertising.
BTW I'm told that the e-book will be distributed free in several places once it has been released in pdf form, although there's no guarantee, so you may want to hang back on buying it.
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... we don't want to give the ----- free advertising.
I think this thread would be more likely to deter buyers. There's no way I'll be wasting my money. The curryhouse recipes were supposed to be the best developed over several years and then a subscription area came out for what is claimed are (suddenly) superior recipes. Now we have someone with a blistering array of different base sauce and recipes - not just the normal 3 bases, but several of EACH type. There's bound to be more for the book. Sorry, but it just doesn't make sense - it doesn't stack up as genuine, e.g, would you really expect a BIR to have different recipes for sit down meals and take-aways?
Regards
George
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Thanks chaps. Got the message! ;)
Cheers
Best regards
SnS ;D
ps: My ebay Secret Indian Restaurant Curry Recipe + SPICES KIT & CD has been posted first class so I should have it by end of week ........
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Right then now for some more information and opinions
Heres another thread shedding some light on previous procedings http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1892.msg16344#msg16344
Andy used to post here from about october 2006 to february 2007. His are the "10 years experience" recipes youll find here. His recent recipes couldnt be more different of course duh? ::)
He claimed that the recipes were from a yorkshire curry restaurant and takeaway that have been in business for over 10 years. But he arrogantly never felt the need to substantiate his grandiose claims and to my knowledgde never has. No photos, no videos, no restaurant addresses, nothing to substantiate his claims despite his promises to the contrary.
It was also the case that his recipes never looked anything like those from a typical bir. Many experienced members here thought so and queried his claims. In fact it looked very much like he copied one particular tomato/onion paste recipe from the natco web site (a recipe allegedly posted by a "M") and he still alledgedly copies other recipes, such as his garam masala recipe, from other sources such as madjhur jaffrey. These seem like word for word copies.
His recipes have since turned tail more times, and more dramatically, than a stunt kite in a high wind i might add. Just a little too implausible for an established restaurant or takeway I think. Hes locked his website down tighter than a ducks bottom, with access permissions, seemingly on route to charging for access. Why anyone would pay for his recipes though is beyond me.
Look. Many people are happy with his recipes, whatever rubbish he throws out. Then again, many of his members are from other parts of the world and wouldnt really know a proper bir curry if it leapt up and bit them in the proverbial backside. He does get raptuous applause from these people for sure ::)
He seemed to use this forum as a stepping stone to poach members from here on his way to seemingly hatching his master plan to make a money from curries (books, supply of spices, cooking classes, paid website access, VIDEOS too it seems? etc). Nothing wrong with that but hes repeatedly denied it which makes him seem very dishonest and untrustworthy to me, if nothing else.
But facts speak louder than words. The best part of fifteen quid for an ebook??? :o
You have to register to download an alleged 8 page sample of the ebook ::) Maybe someone can post a copy here so we can all take a look at it and see the authors and address of the alledged restaurant ourselves? We can then try it out. We might be pleasantly suprised and i for one will need to eat my hat ::)
As for voicing opinions on rcr, id love to but anything other than a "rah rah andy youre the best" gets greeted with infantile derision, insults and a ban ::)
Go check it out for yourselves www.indian-recipe.org and see what you think. You might be utterly delighted with it, if youre from another country or planet or arent really interested in a proper bir curry or dont actually know what one is ::)
Oh heres a photo of his chicken bhuna. I dont know about you but i wouldnt be happy if my chicken bhuna turned out looking like that. Hell i wouldnt even be happy if YOUR chicken bhuna turned out like that. It was promptly deleted from rcr when some enlightened fellow pointed out that it looked pretty dreadful :P Oh, and that member was promptly deleted too lmao. Shame really I happen to think they were right in their opinion lol
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I think Woks Up pretty much hits the nail on the head, I would have loved for it all to be true but it's not. As usual someone trying to take advantage of other peoples desperation to know.
For some reason I couldn't see the bhuna picture so have linked to it here, I guess this is the one you were referring to Woks? Looks the biz... not
(http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1910/bhunavo1.th.jpg) (http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bhunavo1.jpg)
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I'm happy if one of the moderators has moved the thread I started (this one) from the relative back waters of the eBooks category to the more visible 'Lets Talk Curry'. I know it's a potentially controversial topic, which is why I chose the lower profile route! But I consider it's important to be like an 'official opposition' if there are valid counter-arguments and other comments/warnings which may need to be made. Nobody would be happier than me if any of these eBooks are the real deal, i.e. have recipes which most people could follow, with sensible quantities, and which produce curries which really are just like from a BIR. But I think we're already further forward as a group, than most people publishing these eBooks.
I share Woks Up's and other members' concerns. I wouldn't be so concerned about photos (which you can't smell or taste!) if the end result is genuine.
There are 101 reasons why all this looks so suspicious to me. For a start, most BIRs (and McDonalds) are consistent with their dishes not just from year to year but often from decade to decade. I doubt if any BIR's have an R&D type department who develop lots of different base sauces and other recipes. Also, you have to consider motivation here. Money is a good one, although it surely won't be easy to make a lot, unless you are Pat Chapman! Stew has done a first class job setting up this forum and I'm sure it took a fair amount of work. But he's not an incessant poster or working 24-7 developing new recipes, whether these are genuine work from kitchen tests, or just pulled out of thin air, and written down to look good. There's a phenomenal amount of effort going on there from between 1 and perhaps 3 people (at a guess), depending on how sceptical you are.
As I've implied before, all that matters is results. If any of the recipes in that eBook are a great breakthrough in taste terms, I'm ready to eat many of my words.
Regards
George
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I think that's the general idea, purely because we don't want to give the edited for inappropriate language by CA free advertising.
You do know the meaning of double standards don't you CA?
Here's one from you from this page http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2236.msg18940#msg18940
Maybe you simply burnt the sh*t out of the spices and garlic UW?
So as you've appointed yourself chief arbiter of inappropriate language, where do you stand now?
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What on earth are you talking about SS! :o
I was talking about burning garlic! You were talking about a person!
Somewhat of a different context don't you think SS?? I'm sure you can see that?
Besides, you maybe didn't see some follow up posts (subsequently deleted by others) that had bearing on my decision to (innocuously) edit your post!
I suggest that you'd be better placed to recognise your friends and foes SS! :-\
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By the way, we have several members that frequent both sites.
I think we should be receptive to counter arguments too!
I'm sure some of you may feel that Andy's recipes are the "bees knees"??
If so, we'd sure like to hear from you...and the reasons why! :)
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I sincerely hope I did a fair thing by opening this potential can of worms topic. Becaue of the subject, I guess there are some strong emotions and that's when powerful language may be used, understandably so. But, please, please, everyone - try to use language which would be acceptable for somewhere like the House of Commons, rather than risk having this whole topic closed or deleted. Potential buyers of these eBooks risk being expoited and I see it as reasonable and fair to advise caution. Let's try to avoid having the topic closed or deleted. Some editing would be vastly preferable to that.
Regards
George
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By the way, we have several members that frequent both sites.
I think we should be receptive to counter arguments too!
I'm sure some of you may feel that Andy's recipes are the "bees knees"??
If so, we'd sure like to hear from you...and the reasons why! :)
I agree. I'm more than willing to consider both sides of the argument and am quite prepared to have my mind changed if any/many of the recipes actually produce good results, e.g. better than my suggested "Darth 100%" benchmark.
Regards
George
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I went over to the dark side this afternoon and it seems that anything interesting wants paying for!!! Sadly this meant that I was unable to view and hence comment on the image of the pale Bhuna recipe. It strikes me that for a spin off from this site, it's awfully similar in layout.
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I share Woks Up's and other members' concerns. I wouldn't be so concerned about photos (which you can't smell or taste!) if the end result is genuine.
Quite correct George but I would be a bit concerned if it was me faced with eating that particular bhuna ;)
Seriously though it would be great if a new eBook comes out and amazing results can be achieved, the reality is that this one is not it. Most of us on here have tried the recipes or various versions of them already, the difference this time is the disappointment will be doubled because you have not only wasted your time but also your money. No doubt someone on here won't be able to resist(I'm looking at you Haldi) and pay up for it so will look forward to a review.
I should say though that this is my opinion and not that of cr0's or anyone else. I am fully aware that people have produced good results that they are happy with, thats fine but they are not what I am looking for and certainly not worth paying for.
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Hey guys, what's happening?
Is this book written by a member of another forum then?
Is it just another scam?
Has anyone read the ebook or looked at the recipes?
Is it worth getting?
... or is everything about this ebook not a topic of discussion on this forum ???
More info please ...
I'm beginning to wish I hadn't asked now!! :(
From what I can see, if the necessary information isn't available from this forum (for free) with its many very experienced members, then it certainly ain't going to be available on any other forum (free or otherwise).
As for bad language - well it really isn't necessary - and idiots who register with inappropriate and offensive names, just so they can spout off, really need to grow up - or go to another forum. :-[
Regards
SnS
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As for bad language - well it really isn't necessary
I'm inclined to agree. I'm partial to a swear word of two ::) especially during banter. I'm also partial to toilet, sexual and general immature humour. However it would obviously be out of place on this forum as for me, this is more of a classroom / open floor for those of the curry making persuasion.
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No doubt someone on here won't be able to resist(I'm looking at you Haldi) and pay up for it so will look forward to a review.
Yep, you got me!
I'd buy it
I've got all the other curry books which don't work, so why not another?
Maybe there will be something that gets me what I want
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Another couple of thoughts on the promised curry book: (1) the "10 year" recipes prompted lots of questions and clarifications. You can't get that with a book cast in stone (2) If it's sold through Amazon, it will be subject to reviews.
Regards
George
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This thread seems to be wandering from it's original topic guys (i.e. "The Curry Book").
It would be more appropriate to start new threads for discussions on salt, curry bases, etc, etc :P
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Sorry guys but this thread is about "The Curry Book" and not curry bases (as I pointed out above ::)).
I will move the current off-topic posts in this thread to a new thread...but anymore will simply get deleted I'm afraid.
The reason is to make it easier for people to find relevant stuff, of course, so your co-operation would be very much appreciated.
Thankyou 8)
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So has anyone actually downloaded the 8 page sample of this ebook then?
"CS" said it contained the names of the authors, owners and chefs and the name and address of the alledged restaurant? Has anyone seen these? What are they please?
Can someone post a copy of the ebook sample here, please, so we can all see what the great fuss is about?
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I downloaded it but I can't seem to make it work now
It's probably something I am doing wrong
I had to change the screen res to view
Maybe there was something else I've forgotton
Anyhow it looks professional
Similar to the Kushi Cook Book
It had recipes in but with certain key ingredients blanked out
It has slick photos of the curries too
Someone else must have downloaded it
I don't want the ebook anyhow, I like proper books
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I downloaded it but I can't seem to make it work now
It's probably something I am doing wrong
I had to change the screen res to view
Maybe there was something else I've forgotton
Maybe they've set the PDF to expire after viewing once.
If you have Acrobat 7 go to Advanced - Javascript - Document Javascripts
and see if there is a script associated with the document, if so delete it.
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Maybe they've set the PDF to expire after viewing once.
No, the demo is not in acrobat .pdf format but in the form of one of those potentially nasty .exe applications. He's the last person I should trust but I couldn't resist taking a look, after I'd dwelt on whether to take the risk for a couple of days. There are two sample recipes, with some of the ingredients blocked out. One is for chicken tikka. Surprise, surprise the recipe in the book is totally different to the '10 year' recipe which he posted under 'Starters' on this forum last January. Is anyone telling me that a BIR would so radically change their recipe for chicken tikka in the space of a year? Even though there are some ingredients left out, these recipes are as different as can be, including the marinade time. In my opinion these significant differences don't exactly inspire confidence, given they are supposed to come from a BIR which he claims to have known for 10 years. Allow also for the fact that the book is catering for 3x as much chicken.
CHICKEN TIKKA - Andy's 10 year recipe - Jan 2007
1 kg chicken breast skinless and cut into 1-2" chunks
1 cup fresh greek yoghurt
1 cup finely chopped fresh coriander leaves
2 tablespoons ginger paste
3 tablespoons garlic paste
3 tablespoons garam masala
6 whole peppercorns
2 dry red chillies
3 tablespoons lime/ lemon juice
1/2 tsp orange food coloring
METHOD
Relatively complex (see recipe) includes use of food processor
Marinate overnight
Curry Book preview - Jan 2008
3Kg chicken
100ml natural yoghurt
1tbls vegetable oil
1tbls Colemans Garden Mint
1tbls garlic/ginger mix
1.5tbls spice mix powder
0.5tsp garam masala
1tbls dried methi
1tsp orange food colour powder
2tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1.5tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1tsp ingredient removed from demo book
METHOD
Mix all the ingredients together. Rub into chicken.
Marinate for 24 hours
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One is for chicken tikka. Surprise, surprise the recipe in the book is totally different to the '10 year' recipe which he posted under 'Starters' on this forum last January. Is anyone telling me that a BIR would so radically change their recipe for chicken tikka in the space of a year?
George ,you are right
The places I know, get a winning formula, and stick to it
If you buy a vindaloo at monthly intervals it is the same flavour
The only time it isn't, is if it's not the usual chef
Each takeaway/restaurant has a standard curry gravy recipe with set recipes for all the curries made with it.
In fact one place I saw, had the recipes on little bits of paper stuck to the wall above the cooker
That would be worth a photo wouldn't it?
You're right, I'm wrong
How can the book be authentic?
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Why do this to a demo book ?
2tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1.5tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1tsp ingredient removed from demo book
Ah ! a demo book that is not !
I am sure we have all the info on this site so look
no further.
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I can't help wondering how this Curry Book recipe for chicken tikka marinade will compare wth Blade's recipe which many of us rate so highly. The recipe is under 'starters' marked 'better than the BIRs'.
Here's the ingredients which Blade specified in April 2006:
600g Chicken - 4 or 5 breasts
1 hpd tbl Pataks tandoori curry paste (the KEY ingredient as it includes lots of tamarind)
1 tsp mint sauce
1 hpd tsp garlic paste
1 tsp ginger paste
2+2 tbl lemon juice (Jiff is ok)
1/2 tsp chilli powder
1 dsp spice mixture (equal parts ground coriander, turmeric, garamasala, curry powder). I use this same mix for my curries.
1/4 tsp orange food colouring (much nicer than red)
1 lvl tsp methi
1 lvl tsp salt
2 tbl veg oil
3 tbl water
I'd go as far as suggesting that the persons(s) behind the Curry Book had noticed the warm reception which Blade's recipe had received and then effectively copied it with just enough changes to introduce an element of doubt. Note the mint sauce, veg oil, etc. which were not present in the '10 year' recipe, three months before Blade's recipe was posted.
Then, on the Blade thread, I suggested adding some yoghurt and others agreed, so that's been incorprated, too.
Regards
George
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I think you could be right George, it certainly wouldn't surprise me given the amount of other blatant copying that has taken place. Madhur Jaffrey spice mixes, the Natco base\onion paste, Pat Chapmans garam massala and thats just what I've noticed there is probably more. Seems a little odd that a restaurant seemingly dropped ten years worth of work only to copy a few recipes of the internet ::)
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The RCR website serves no other purpose than for commercial gain. The guy is out to make money, pure and simple.
I would be suprised if people paid 15 pounds for an ebook.
Stew 8)
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The RCR website serves no other purpose than for commercial gain. The guy is out to make money, pure and simple.
I would be suprised if people paid 15 pounds for an ebook.
Not many will. A few will out of curiosity, but A Roberts - name editied by CA
is never going to make much from this content removed as inappropriate by CA. There are
too many people who are willing to share knowledge for free,
for starters. If he actually possessed some valuable intellectual
property, e.g. 'I am the chef of XYZ restaurant which has won
the following awards' and CAN PROVE IT then he might have something.
As it is, he hasn't so content removed as inappropriate by CA he will be found out
as he did on this forum.
I feel sorry for all the uninformed lot on RCR really.
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I feel sorry for all the uninformed lot on RCR really.
This has to be the most bitchy site I have had the misfortune to be associated with......rest of thread deleted as inappropriate and personally offensive by CA
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This has to be the most bitchy site I have had the misfortune to be associated with.
I can't see how we're talking about the same site, if you mean cr0. I wouldn't say that about RCR either - it's not bitchy and, like this site, it concentrates 95% on the main subject matter, but its disciples are so misguided IMHO. I don't see anything 'bitchy' or unacceptable about trying to expose an alleged scam. Most of the folks here strike me as some of the nicest people around but, like anyone, we can be pushed too far.
If you'd chosen to put forward a rational point of view, I might have wished your post would be allowed to stand. But it seems you're determined to have your post deleted by using very rude language, which no half-decent forum can tolerate. Why is it necessary for anyone to sink so low?
Regards
George
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Hi Guys,
Personal attacks are inappropriate and are uneccessary.
Please let's refrain from this and try and keep things, as far as possible, to an impersonal and objective review of the sample ebook, the proposed ebook, and the evidence that supports (or not) the author's claims that the recipes come from pucker BIR restaurants and takeaways with over 10 years experience in the market place.
Objective (and impersonal) counter views are most welcome, but your tirade most certainly was not that "currygal" ::)
So, can anyone post the sample book (more free advertising!)?
Does it divulge the author's, owner's, chef's names, and that of the alleged restaurant, as CS claimed it does? If so, what are they please?
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Why do this to a demo book ?
2tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1.5tbls ingredient removed from demo book
1tsp ingredient removed from demo book
...maybe to give the illusion that there are secret ingredients!
Graeme? ;)
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Personal attacks are inappropriate and are uneccessary.
You are right of course CA and I apologise to all. :-[ I will post no more on the topic.
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So, can anyone post the sample book (more free advertising!)?
Here's page 3:
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b191/tx55j67a/CurryBookP3.jpg)
Other pages to follow...please check later.
Come on guys. I'm keen to hear of any of these recipes which work. I don't mean recipes lifted from here or elsewhere, which we already know work, but recipes which MAY be new. Can anyone report any success from any of the 10 year / RCR recipes they tried?
Regards
George
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I've downloaded the sample book and it doesnt really say a lot. I cant post it as i didnt try printscreening it but it didnt give much of an idea about whether the book will be worth the money.
The establishment is not named.
I post regularly on RCR and have had success with the recipes lately. The earlier mild base recipes didnt really do it for me but the new melting base ones are very good. They are also very similar to what i have seen in the 2 BIRs that i have visited. I'd suggest giving it a go as it's a simple base sauce and doesnt make too much. Personally i thin it down more so it's the consistency of milk.
I think the biggest and most constant source of our disapointment is the fact that a lot of us (on both sites) are not decent cooks already. This isnt an attack, it's just obvious from the way people talk about ingredients/techniques. We are attempting to perfect one of the most highly regarded cuisines in the world. You cant just give a recipe to someone and have them make the same dish as a decent chef, it's never going to happen.
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I post regularly on RCR and have had success with the recipes lately.
Chionis
What a refreshing post. Many thanks for giving some idea if what the new RCR base sauces offer. Especially if they don't require 20Kg of onions as a starting point, I may give one or more a try.
Regards
George
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When you learn about classic cuisines you notice that the original recipes dont have amounts or much instruction in them. Ingredients may have been measured but they were not recorded in the recipes because the cook was expected to be able to understand and work it out for themselves.
A good example is a thai curry paste: each ingredient is added to the pestle & mortar separately until the aroma balances the previous ingredient (which are added in opposites, chilli then lemongrass for example). People started to write comprehensive recipes so we could shortcut the experience & learning needed for this task. Now we have standardized recipes but they dont take into account the differences occuring in nature. Ingredients vary dramatically and modern recipes have now forgotten to mention this. Then the food processor arrived (which shreads and doesnt pound like the pestle) and the result changes again. The difference is obvious when written out like this but in a recipe they would be identical.
This is an example of why you need to be discerning in who you learn from (i.e. dont just trust google to come up with a recipe) and how keenly you learn/get involved. Recipes should be like essays basically! With regard to BIR you need to understand the ingredients and how they work, which is no small feat. You need to be constantly smelling/tasting so you get used to the differences that occur each time you do something. I find i often have to do control experiments to work things out. When you taste you need to be discerning rather than accepting. You need to try and criticize every aspect of the food in your mouth. Check there is enough salt to bring out the flavours (and spices need salt as much as anything else, dont listen to the health experts), that the sweetness is correct and that the overall 'feel' in the mouth is correct. I'm sure most of you have tried making multiple base sauces and found shortcomings in all of them. All you need to do is keep tasting them to work out what is wrong with them. Be the critic. The presence of onions which havent been completely cooked is the most common IMO so you'll probably recognize that 'vegetable sharpness' already. If you keep on with the other ingredients, even smelling a piece of ginger between tastes of the sauce to help you notice a subtle spicy edge to the aroma which you previously thought was to do with the ground spices, you'll be on the right track.
This way you'll find that with most recipes you will actually do them slightly differently to how they are written down, and might need to make adjustments each time. Dont let this deter you or make you think the recipe isnt perfect as this is how the professionals do it. They taste each dish & each sauce before it is served.
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Come on guys. I'm keen to hear of any of these recipes which work. I don't mean recipes lifted from here or elsewhere, which we already know work, but recipes which MAY be new. Can anyone report any success from any of the 10 year / RCR recipes they tried?
Regards
George
I have made quite a few of the melting base recipes and think they are excellent. I made a chicken Jalfrezi on Friday and it was equal to if not better than a lot of BIR's in my area. I also totally agree with what Chinois says regarding cooking skills.
George - I do not understand why, if you are genuinely interested in the quality of the RCR recipes. Why you don't try them yourself? It is not a secret society. It just seems to be some sort of sport for certain people to keep ridiculing without actually trying.
Give them a try, you might be impressed.
regards
Ian
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It is not a secret society. It just seems to be some sort of sport for certain people to keep ridiculing without actually trying.
Give them a try, you might be impressed.
I think a lot of what has been said is based on mistrust Ian, plenty of people have tried them and the results have been mixed. The recipes have even evolved according to peoples feedback and to see the next 'version' it's going to cost you 15 quid.
Excuse my suspicion but it's been under a year since RCR started up yet theres a spice shop, an ebook and a video store on the way. Not bad going given there was supposed to be no money angle but I suppose it's going to fund the seven grands worth of servers for the new video store ::)
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George - I do not understand why, if you are genuinely interested in the quality of the RCR recipes. Why you don't try them yourself? It is not a secret society. It just seems to be some sort of sport for certain people to keep ridiculing without actually trying.
Give them a try, you might be impressed.
I agree that some of the latest recipes may be worth a try, so I will! Thank you for your feedback. Here's some ways that RCR could allay some of the doubts and suspicions:
1. If some of the recipes really do produce good results which from what you say, it sounds like they might.
2. To name the restaurant which these recipes are claimed to come from, which it sounds like might happen in the book, and I hope it does.
3. For a few bonus points, if we went to dine in the restaurant and the dishes were very similar to the ones cooked up at home then, wow! - that would be a major breakthrough. It's just that we've lost count of the number of previous books which have made this claim, yet it seems as if none have fully delivered, despite grand promises on the covers like 'your friends won't be able to tell the difference'!
Regards
George
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It is not a secret society. It just seems to be some sort of sport for certain people to keep ridiculing without actually trying.
Give them a try, you might be impressed.
I think a lot of what has been said is based on mistrust Ian, plenty of people have tried them and the results have been mixed. The recipes have even evolved according to peoples feedback and to see the next 'version' it's going to cost you 15 quid.
Excuse my suspicion but it's been under a year since RCR started up yet theres a spice shop, an ebook and a video store on the way. Not bad going given there was supposed to be no money angle but I suppose it's going to fund the seven grands worth of servers for the new video store ::)
I hear what you are saying and I myself had no success with the original savory base recipes. The ones I have had good results from though are the melting base recipes. Personally I have no problems if people see a business oportunity and want to make some money, good luck to them. At the end of the day it is all down to individual choice, No one has to pay anything if they do not want to ! There is an e book available but the recipes will also be on the site as some of them already are and that is free the same as here.
If you can achieve the taste you are after from a group of people who are willing to help you, does it really matter whether you have dined in the source restaurant or not?
Anyhow as I said, it is all personal choice I just don't understand people who knock things they haven't tried. Obviously I can't demonstrate the taste to you but I am willing to put a couple of pics of the ones I have tried (As long as the feedback is constructive :) )
Ian
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Here's the 2nd of 6 pages of content from the Curry Book demo application. It was said to have 8 pages but two are blank! I hope they don't mind the advertising. More pages to follow.
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b191/tx55j67a/CurryBookP7.jpg)
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The only thing that bothers me about RCR, is this niggling doubt that the recipes are genuine
I keep finding things that make me doubt it
I really want it to be real
There is nothing wrong with posting recipes, you have made up
But I don't want to be decieved about it
I hope this book finally sorts this issue out
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A couple of things spring to mind ::)
From the authors of "Indian Restaurant and Takeaway Recipes revealed" ;D
You have got to be joking, how many people is that now who claim to have written that poor excuse for a recipe ebook!
Only be limited in numbers, order early to avoid disappointment, why, surely its just a matter of copying the exe file again? Or is this a ploy to capitalize on early orders before everyone realizes it's not actually that good.
Machine locked! Any attempt to duplicate the book will disable the original book from opening! I can imagine your hard drive melting mission impossible style if you attempt to copy an ebook you have brought and paid for, hardly a way to treat customers who have actually paid out for it.
75% off the printed version when it comes out, grand claims yet again and given how many of these previous claims never came about I doubt this will either. They might also want to run it through a spell check before submitting it to the publishers ;)
Anyway where do I send my fifteen pounds :D
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I think Haldi has expressed the view of several (if not many) members here. I certainly share that view.
Many (normal) people do not want to be, or feel as if, they are being deceived, lied to, misled, duped, call it what you will. Andy's escapades certainly have that feel to them, real or otherwise. ::)
All the evidence suggests that Andy is in this venture for commercial gain. I agree that this is perfectly acceptable, but his cries to the contrary simply serve to cement people's mistrust.
Unfortunately, Andy has provided far more questions than answers. He has failed to respond to what, in my opinion, are very reasonable requests to substantiate his claims as to his credentials and the origin of his recipes.
He claims that the recipes come from restaurants and takeaway with over 10 years experience. I can see no reason why he won't disclose their names or their whereabouts. The business could ONLY benefit from this disclosure, surely? I can think of NO reason why it wouldn't. The only reasons are either those I don't see, or that the restaurant and takeaway simply don't exist in the way that's claimed.
And, yes, it IS important to many people that Andy substantiates his credentials. "I'm a doctor, so just trust me!" simply doesn't wash I'm afraid! It also pompous and arrogant for others to determine that it's unimportant. Maybe to them it is, but to many others it clearly is not.
I also cannot understand why an electronic version of a book would be "strictly limited..so order now!". Maybe someone could explain this to me please?
I am surprised to see the sample ebook contains a photos of Andy's chicken bhoona recipes that Wok's up posted! Presumably this will suffice to illustrate the quality of the recipes, and the end results to be expected so, in my opinion, we won't be needing any more photos thankyou very much Ian. There is a limit to how much free advertising we will supply, after all ;)
It is also unsurprising that you, Ian, find Andy's recipes "excellent". You are, after all, the most prolific poster on that site, this month, and the fifth most prolific poster of all with over 1000 posts (and only 34 here?). I also believe that you're some sort of "recipe tester" there? On the other hand, Chinois is the 19th most prolific poster on RCR with 153 posts (and only 6 here, excluding the 2 in this thread). So whilst your contibutions are welcome, I think we should also recognise the potential for bias.
Nevertheless, it's good to see that you both find them "excellent" and "very good", respectively, and you're right in saying that people should try them and see for themselves.
And Chinois, I agree with you that the ebook sample provides very little additional information. The rest of your posts, whilst very eloquent and interesting (and, perhaps, somewhat patronising to some), really aren't relevant to this discussion, I'm afraid. You second post almost seems to be an extract from a book? I don't know?
And Ian, I'm afraid that RCR DOES appear to resemble a "secret society" in that only POSITIVE "constructive criticism" appears to be allowed and NEGATIVE "constructive criticism" is stamped on, greeted with ridicule, and the member banned.
I see Curry Canuck is now a moderator there and Andy has lost his marbles! Good luck to both of them! :)
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And Chinois, The rest of your posts, whilst very eloquent and interesting (and, perhaps, somewhat patronising to some), really aren't relevant to this discussion, I'm afraid. You second post almost seems to be an extract from a book? I don't know?
Yeah i thought so too, i started writing and i couldnt stop. Suggesting i lifted it from a book is strange but a good example of the weird and childish hostility between our two curry sites. It's true that writing in full english without 'text-slang' or smilies isnt always the norm but we can all talk passionately without hysterics when we want to.
Maybe the post's not quite in the right thead so if a forum person wants to move it to the long thread about whether there is a secret ingredient they can do.
Patronization's always an issue when trying to explain something but i thought i'd done alright on that. Suggesting that not everyone might be an exceptional cook with a finely honed sense of taste is more obvious/realistic than patronizing i thought. I also pointed out that i was one of them and not an 'i'm on the internet so i'm going to exaggerate everything and think of myself as elite' character. We can refer to the still ongoing purpose of this site & RCR to see that hardly anyone has cracked this curry thing yet.
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I didn't mean it to seem "weird and childish" Chinois. I literally felt as if I was reading the introduction to a curry cooking book! Take that as you will (even be flattered because it was, if nothing else, very eloquent and an informative opinion!). Maybe it was simply that it seemed way out of context with this thread?
I will copy and post it to a more relevant thread, because it is very interesting nevertheless! ;) :P (note irritating use of smilies! ;))
PS: your last post seems to have lost some of its previous eloquence, Chinois, I must admit! :o
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PS: your last post seems to have lost some of its previous eloquence, Chinois, I must admit! :o
Cheeky, but good call
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Hey Chinois,
I don't really mean to appear rude. From what I've seen of your posts (granted, mostly on RCR ;)) seems to indicate that you're equally passionate as the rest of us on the "BIR curry cooking quest"! As I'm sure Ian is too.
As you rightly state, we are all after the same end result. To me, it's just important how we get there. To others, it may be less so.
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Chinois
I thought your previous detailed post(s) were very interesting and you raised some good points which had occurred to me, too, like tasting a dish after each stage, as long as you know what is should be like at each stage, of course! Are these, effectively 'amateur ideas, like mine, or do you have some background/training in catering, by any chance?
Regards
George
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It is also unsurprising that you, Ian, find Andy's recipes "excellent". You are, after all, the most prolific poster on that site, this month, and the fifth most prolific poster of all with over 1000 posts (and only 34 here?). I also believe that you're some sort of "recipe tester" there? On the other hand, Chinois is the 19th most prolific poster on RCR with 153 posts (and only 6 here, excluding the 2 in this thread). So whilst your contibutions are welcome, I think we should also recognise the potential for bias.
And Ian, I'm afraid that RCR DOES appear to resemble a "secret society" in that only POSITIVE "constructive criticism" appears to be allowed and NEGATIVE "constructive criticism" is stamped on, greeted with ridicule, and the member banned.
Let me try and answer a couple of those comments from my point of view.
1) Yes I do post a lot on RCR. Purely because I have found success with the melting base recipes and if I can help other people by sharing my successes/failures then I am more than happy to do it. Surely that is what these forums are about? I have no interest whatsoever in bickering between members. I have one sole purpose and that is to achieve BIR style food at home which I am passionate about, as I am sure most people on both of the forums are. I am not really sure what you are inferring?
2) Recipe tester ;D Not sure where that came from ? I can only assume the CTM pic that I posted before the recipe was made available. That was purely because I kept pestering Andy for it. If that somehow makes me a bad person CA then so be it ::)
3)With regard negative critisicm. As far as I am aware the only reason members have been banned was because of repeated personal abuse on the site and then re-registering under another name. As a moderator CA you surely know only too well that cannot be allowed.
That is all I will post on the subject as I don't think we will ever agree. As i said before it is all personal choice. Keep cooking everyone.
Ian
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Hey Guys
Please can we drop this subject. I for one am getting sick of seeing "Curry Book" postings appearing almost hourly only to find everyone having a go at each other which really is not helpful.
Can we pleeeeease draw a line under this one today .......... thanks
SnS ;D
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You could be right there SS I'm guilty myself and if no one objects shall we lock this thread and await a review of the book itself?
There are lots of differing opinions and as Ian says it is unlikely everyone will agree so lets wait for the book itself so it can be judged on it's own merits.
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shall we lock this thread
I think that may a wise move ... before it gets completely out of hand.
Thanks CK
Best regards
SnS ;D
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We can refer to the still ongoing purpose of this site & RCR to see that hardly anyone has cracked this curry thing yet.
And isn't that the real issue? I have never (I repeat never) been able to reproduce the unique taste and smell (particularly the smell) of the curries I used to have pre- 1990(ish).
I have tried several of the RCR recipes and the melting base ones are the closest to the way I used to have them but, they are still sadly lacking.
IanR I truly feel sorry for you that you seem to think that the melting base recipes are better than your local, but unfortunately I can believe it. The RCR recipes are generally alright and in the BIR style, but like a real old style BIR..NO!
They do however represent a good copy of the second rate slop that now predominates the BIR scene, and in that respect I believe the book will be accurate.
My greatest wish would be to find just one restaurant that makes decent curries, old style, and to drag you there to show you what a diservice you are doing to the BIR scene by bigging up Andy's efforts.
Unfortunately I am truly at my wits end to find just one restaurant that produces such curries any more. And it's not that I'm fussy or anything. All the curry houses, and I do mean all, that I used to frequent in various parts of the country had this taste and smell, but it has now gone.
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I would be suprised if people paid 15 pounds for an ebook.
Like I said in another post, it will be made available for free shortly after it is released in pdf form. Just don't buy it straight away, give it a while.
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You could be right there SS I'm guilty myself and if no one objects shall we lock this thread and await a review of the book itself?
For what it's worth, I object to the idea of locking the thread. I value many of the inputs from various standpoints. It's interesting. Any posts or parts which go too far can and should be deleted or edited but, to lock the whole thread seems undesirable. If people get fed up with this subject, then it can petre out. As it is, this is one of the most visited, fastest growing threads of recent times and I'm pleased I started it.
Regards
George
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I have tried several of the RCR recipes and the melting base ones are the closest to the way I used to have them but, they are still sadly lacking...They do however represent a good copy of the second rate slop that now predominates the BIR scene, and in that respect I believe the book will be accurate.
SS
I'm getting more interested in this melting base recipe if it's one of the best so far, even if it falls short of your ultimate idea for a curry. How does it compare with Darth's 100% recipe would you say - anyone who's tried both? Also, how much do you have to pay for it? I gather there's some sort of charge to get access to the 'melting' section of RCR.
It would be lucky indeed if any BIR prepared to divulge its recipes was one of the best. Like you, I only aspire to copy the great BIR curries - not just any old BIR curry.
Regards
George
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I'm getting more interested in this melting base recipe if it's one of the best so far, even if it falls short of your ultimate idea for a curry. Also, how much do you have to pay for it? I gather there's some sort of charge to get access to the 'melting' section of RCR.
I was a member before the limited access & groups side of RCR and dont really know what the deal is. I'm pretty sure there's no charging involved though as i have heard no mention of it. I believe you've always had to register to see some of the recipe and maybe you have to wait a day or so for the registration to become active (to stop spammers). Try that and if it doesnt work someone can always PM you a printscreens of a few recipes inc the gravy one.
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This has to be the most bitchy site I have had the misfortune to be associated with.
We have our moments currygall but would RCR allow this type of free discussion? You know they would not. Even if the argument is constructively phrased it is immediately banned/treated with ridicule/generally lambasted (not to mention the personal insults which are allowed), if it in any way disrupts the RCR money making ethos.
Oh and by the way, don't you think it's just a tad suspicious that Anne, a moderator, is the mouthpiece/owner of the RCR spice suppliers? Did you not find it weird that the latest attempt at BIR replication needed a particular brand of curry mix that is not (generally) available to the British public, but is surprisingly easily available from the RCR spice shop?
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I think the biggest and most constant source of our disapointment is the fact that a lot of us (on both sites) are not decent cooks already.
No it's not. The biggest source of disappointment is the people on RCR who claim that not only are the RCR curries BIR standard, but that they are even better than BIR. And the truth is that some of them are. The biggest source of disappointment then is that there are so many ill-educated palates out there (through no fault of their own).
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For what it's worth, I object to the idea of locking the thread. I value many of the inputs from various standpoints. It's interesting. Any posts or parts which go too far can and should be deleted or edited but, to lock the whole thread seems undesirable. If people get fed up with this subject, then it can petre out. As it is, this is one of the most visited, fastest growing threads of recent times and I'm pleased I started it.
Regards
George
Yeah thats why I asked and fair play so let's just see how it goes.
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I think the biggest and most constant source of our disapointment is the fact that a lot of us (on both sites) are not decent cooks already.
No it's not. The biggest source of disappointment is the people on RCR who claim that not only are the RCR curries BIR standard, but that they are even better than BIR. And the truth is that some of them are. The biggest source of disappointment then is that there are so many ill-educated palates out there (through no fault of their own).
I think we're in agreement with you but i dont quite follow. Are you saying the problem is that there are a lot of bad BIRs and people are comparing their results to these establishments rather than to the best BIRs?
If so:
I have definately noticed the change of quality since moving to london. Around Winchester (near southampton) the standard was high and rarely varied. In north london (and brick lane) about half of the places i have been are bad. My friend says that this is his experience too. A few tikkas i have eaten have been overcooked scrag-ends of meat with food dye on. No flavour of spices or tandoor. They seem to be so keep on keeping the price below ?5 a dish, like the chinese takeaways do. I wish they'd both take more pride.
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Are you saying the problem is that there are a lot of bad BIRs and people are comparing their results to these establishments rather than to the best BIRs?
A qualified yes to that. But also that the "best" BIRs no longer exist. I know I'm repeating myself but I can't find a restaurant or takeaway that cooks curries in the old style, I feel foolish saying that but it's true.
It's tedious even to me, and I'm the one making the point, but there is (was) a whole different flavour and smell to a real good BIR curry. It wasn't anything unique to any place geographically, but I swear it has just gone, disappeared. It is totally soul destroying to me.
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The biggest source of disappointment is the people on RCR who claim that not only are the RCR curries BIR standard, but that they are even better than BIR.
Something else I don't like is the way in which the senior lecturer(s) who were here and are now over there - speak as if they are an ultimate oracle of knowledge, making statements of fact (the way they write) rather than opinions, suggestions and/or recommendations. Some pupils in the 'class' ask questions and the professor responds! If this person 'came out', declared who he is and could demonstrate proof of cooking experience/qualifications I might be a lot more accepting but I somehow doubt that type of background.
CK - thanks for being prepared to keep the thread open.
Regards
George
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author=George link=topic=2243.msg19321#msg19321 date=1199738483
I'm getting more interested in this melting base recipe if it's one of the best so far, even if it falls short of your ultimate idea for a curry. How does it compare with Darth's 100% recipe would you say - anyone who's tried both?
Regards
George
The base involves a boiled spiced water
It gives a very tasty result, but not the same as BIR's I know
If frozen it comes back with a strong bay leaf aroma
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It gives a very tasty result, but not the same as BIR's I know
If frozen it comes back with a strong bay leaf aroma
Haldi
Do you mean the melting base recipes aren't like almost any BIR you've ever visited, or just not like your local/favourite BIRs? If they are good in absolute terms, it sort of sounds like the meting base recipes may be worthy of consideration in a sub-category of authentic curries, or UK curries with sultanas and apples, for example, but are not what we're primarily looking for here at cr0.
Regards
George
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Do you mean the melting base recipes aren't like almost any BIR you've ever visited, or just not like your local/favourite BIRs? If they are good in absolute terms, it sort of sounds like the meting base recipes may be worthy of consideration in a sub-category of authentic curries, or UK curries with sultanas and apples, for example, but are not what we're primarily looking for here at cr0.
Regards
George
I thought the curry was almost homestyle, except that it has gravy rather than chopped onions
It is very good though but not actually like any bir I have had (anywhere)
Everybody ate it and liked it
On second thoughts, perhaps it's a bit like old style bir curry too
It's this spiced stock/water that does it
You are boiling cardamons,cinammon, bay leaf then adding to the base
It's like that "ahkni stock" that Pat Chapman wrote about
Personally I find that dominates the flavour of the base
The bay leaf aroma stands out a mile
For me,that isn't the first thing I notice, about an opened carton of takeaway curry
It is amazing how the onions virtually disappear as you gently fry them
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My greatest wish would be to find just one restaurant that makes decent curries, old style, and to drag you there to show you what a diservice you are doing to the BIR scene by bigging up Andy's efforts.
Unfortunately I am truly at my wits end to find just one restaurant that produces such curries any more. And it's not that I'm fussy or anything. All the curry houses, and I do mean all, that I used to frequent in various parts of the country had this taste and smell, but it has now gone.
Secret Santa, I know exactly what you mean however there are BIRs out there with the same 80s/90s taste. I'm from Glasgow and could recommend one or two that still hit the mark. Also one in Blackpool of all places - it was the business.
One thing I'd recommend to you as an experiment.... do not get a madras or vindaloo next time... just get something like a bhoona - standard strength. The Blackpool restaurant madras for example was good, however the plain old chicken bhoona that my son got was out of this world. I spoke to the owner about it at the time and he said he had the same chef for many many years - wouldn't trade him for the world he said.
Let me know if you want any more info on the ones I know about...
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Yes please Jethro, perhaps you could post your recommendations here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/board,44.0.html (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/board,44.0.html)
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The bay leaf aroma stands out a mile
Hi Haldi,
Does it specify Asian (rather than European) Bay Leaves?
They really do have an overpowering (harsh, musty, aniseedy) smell and taste, I find, that I've never really ever detected in BIR curries before.
I've used them, from time to time, but I really don't like them. I avoid them now and would never use them in anything other than a meat (i.e. not in a chicken or fish or vegetable) curry, if at all.
Yes, the similarities between this "melting base" and Pat Chapman's "Akhni" stock also struck me.
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Hi Haldi,
Does it specify Asian (rather than European) Bay Leaves?
Yes, the asian bay leaf
I buy mine from asian supermakets
One pack lasts a couple of years
They don't seem to lose any flavour
The only recipe, I find they work in, is pillau rice
Did we ever find out, if the ebook told us, which restaurant the recipes came from?
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Did we ever find out, if the ebook told us, which restaurant the recipes came from?
No of course not haldi ::)
I downloaded this sample ebook and it really adds nothing but two names - G Zilanee and A Roberts - presumably as the authors of the esteemed publication
Sounds to me more like G Zilanee might play football for italy rather than be an indian cook ;)
I cant believe hes put that crappy looking chicken bhoona picture in there. It looks nothing like a bhoona should look. It should be dry and the sauce should stick to the meat. This looks runny and insipid. Though I suppose its not finished yet huh ::)
And lets not forget about the other esteemed money making sites registered in andys name where he promises:
"real SECRET INDIAN restaurant recipes"
"real SECRET CHINESE restaurant recipes"
"real SECRET MEXICAN restaurant recipes"
"rea; SECRET ITALIAN restaurant recipes"
Not bad for someone who claims that are no secrets ::)
And dont forget the other sites in his name:
"ultimate gallery"
"food bazarre (should it be bizarre?)"
"spices and herbs on line"
Where in total he looks like planning to sell anything from books to spices to pulses to chutneys to wines to beers...... ::)
Check out the mother site registered in his name here http://www.all-recipe.co.uk/joomla1/ (http://www.all-recipe.co.uk/joomla1/) nice banners
Naaaah, he aint in it for the money, course not ::)
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lmao, that sites been changed now! ;D
Oh well, go to http://www.all-recipe.co.uk (http://www.all-recipe.co.uk) before thats changed too lol
In case it is, check on the "drinks" site registered in his name here http://www.all-recipe.co.uk/drinks/ (http://www.all-recipe.co.uk/drinks/) where it promises:
"Welcome to Drinks. Whether your throwing a party or just relaxing with a friend, you will find great drinks here to quench your thirst. Come in and browse around. If you see something you like, try it and let us know how it was. Don't forget to tell your friends about us!"
Hes not in it it for money. Hes not devious. Hes just a good guy out to help his friends throughout the world that he doesnt actually know ::)
Surely he hasnt REALLY tried to conceal his plot by quickly changing that site has he? I can hardly believe it lmao ;D
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Hahahahah.....lmao...that sites been deactivated TOO now :o
Thats amazing! Covering tracks or what! ::)
Luckily I took screen shots and saved my internet cache ;)
Try to tell me THATS the actions of a man to be trusted ::)
What a devious scoundrel he seems to be! :P
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I downloaded this sample ebook and it really adds nothing but two names - G Zilanee and A Roberts - presumably as the authors of the esteemed publication
Really? So where has the mystical curry-guru named Ali got to then? It was always made clear that everything on RCR had to be OK'd with Ali before it could be put on the site. Surely the head chef and owner of the restaurant (Ali), after whom these recipes are supposed to originate, would want his name up there in lights too, wouldn't he?
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According to "steve" (admin) at rcr my "outbursts" are "ill informed", I "gets most of it all wrong" and "the mentioned sites "Mexican-Food-Recipes" belongs to and is run by a company in AZ, "Italian-Food-Recipes" is owned and run by an organisation in Italy. "Chinese-Food-Recipes" is privately owned by an individual with no connection to us either" he says ::)
Well, lets look at the some of the available facts shall we. Bear in mind that "someone" was busy deleting many of these as I was making my previous posts. I wonder why? ::)
This is the public domain registration information for the sites mentioned:
Registered Domain name: chinese-food-recipe.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 18-Mar-2007
Renewal date: 18-Mar-2009
Last updated: 08-Jan-2008
Registered Domain name: italian-food-recipe.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 20-Mar-2007
Renewal date: 20-Mar-2009
Last updated: 14-Dec-2007
Registered Domain name: mexican-food-recipe.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 20-Mar-2007
Renewal date: 20-Mar-2009
Last updated: 05-Jan-2008
Registered Domain name: foodbazaar.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 14-Apr-2007
Renewal date: 14-Apr-2009
Last updated: 14-Apr-2007
Registered Domain name: spicesandherbs.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 01-Apr-2007
Renewal date: 01-Apr-2009
Last updated: 02-Apr-2007
Registered Domain name: all-recipe.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 18-Mar-2007
Renewal date: 18-Mar-2009
Last updated: 18-Mar-2007
Registered Domain name: realcurryrecipes.co.uk
Registrant: Andy Roberts
Relevant dates: Registered on: 30-Jan-2007
Renewal date: 30-Jan-2009
Note some of the very recent updates to this registrant information, the chinese restaurant one as recently as 8th January! Maybe he just forgot that he has a connection with them then? ::)
I also have many screen shots of the mentioned sites before they were modified or deactivated on the 9th January as I was posting. But I'll spare you these details unless requested otherwise because im sure most of you will find it exceedingly boring and maybe consider it all a bit irrelevant.
But everything points to an absolutely clear connection to andy and these sites. So why the continual denial and deception? All rather strange for someone claiming to have "no connection with" these sites don't you think? Next hell be telling us he has nothing to do with rcr I expect. ::)
I have no objection to anyone making money from these ventures but its this continual denial and deceit that rankles me. Why wouldn't he just say that hes developed the sites and sold them or given them away (cos hes a good guy not in it for money oh no) to someone else or whatever the situation is? Why pull the wool over eyes and expect people to follow him like sheep? What? Oh they do :P
And for those that think this has absolutely no bearing on the topic of this thread, ask yourself this, are you buying a genuine rolex (and paying the price for it) or are you getting one actually made in china despite the claims to the contrary? :-\
And for any of you not interested in this stuff dont read it.
These views are all mine my personal views of course and are not necessarily those of or endorsed by cr0 or its administration or its owners.
I would discuss them on rcr but they continually ban me amidst personal insults, questioning of my intelligence and general childish ridicule from their hardcore (and some soft core ones too) ::)
Maybe you should lock this thread now its seems to be going nowhere fast and is all getting pretty boring. Lets see what happens when the book comes out. :-\
Available free as a pdf you say secret santa? I think ill wait then ;)
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These views are all mine my personal views of course and are not necessarily those of or endorsed by cr0 or its administration or its owners.
For what it's worth I suppport your views and am pleased that someone is prepared to set out a strong case by way of a counter-argument.
I hope that neither your post is deleted or heavily modified, or that this thread is locked.
Regards
George
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Well, I'm not getting it now
I'm totally put off
It really does seem that the author is not a genuine character
The bit that really swayed me was, the absence of Ali fom the book credits
I think this is a book that will never be written, but always for sale
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Im also not getting it now haldi I must admit.
I have tried to decipher "steves" (rcr admin) latest ramblings on rcr (the stuff in quotes is "steves"). Ive put the more interesting stuff up front and the largely insulting, irrelevant and boring stuff at the end:
This following claim leaves me rather bemused - "thecurrybook.com" (which seems to be there to promote and sell the curry book, the indian chef cook video series etc) "has no ties to rcr and is run independently as a business". Apparently "this has been made quite clear" lol :o
Huh? What would they have us believe here then? That the curry book now has nothing to do with rcr? I thought the "tie" was clear. Andy is seemingly the registered owner of rcr - or are they going to deny this too? lmao Rcr has been promoting the curry book as some sort of spin-off compilation of rcr recipes (and was to include rcr member curry photos, screen names, comments, etc). Andy is also writing the curry book (seemingly together with G Zilanee who may or may not be Ali) and "thecurrybook.com" is seemingly formerly promoting and selling it? The "tie" seems pretty clear to me. Maybe I just don't understand it or cant read properly? lol ::)
And I thought I was joking when I quipped that soon they'll be telling us andy has no connection to rcr either! rofl ::)
That's about all there is of the interesting stuff. The following is less interesting because it tells us nothing: ::)
"Steve" has attached copies of two short and rather uninformative emails (in the context of this debate) allegedly from the registrar of two of the seven plus sites that I ("the ill informed woks up" lol) "keeps spouting about" lol. "Steve" has apparently "checked with the registrar for absolute confirmation". Of what though he fails to say roflmao :P
Maybe he forgot what it was he was supposed to be confirming? They seem to reveal nothing other than "moving" a domain from one account to another? Two sites, no dates, no nothing. They tell us nothing about the current or previous registered owners of the seven plus sites mentioned. Would they really have us believe that andy has no connection with nor ever has had any connection with any of these sites, despite andy apparently being the registered owner of all of them and having his name (as forum administrator mostly) and/or email address (as the "contact us" person) being splattered over most of them.....until some of the sites were edited or deactivated on Wednesday of course? lol Would they have us believe that my registrant information is all wrong? Surely not? We may be stupid but not THAT stupid lol. Amazingly some people at rcr think this "important information" clarifies things? Huh? roflmao ::)
Now for the largely insulting, irrelevant and boring stuff:
There are individuals on this site that "breed on bullsh**t" (seems like he means you lot - charming). There are people like me who "generate it" (ie "bullsh**t") through not understanding it" or "have to take things as read without actually getting the facts correct first". Trust me steve I can sniff out "bulsh**t" from a million miles away ::)
There are "leading sheep" (presumably that's me lol) and there are "followers who simply follow" (seems like he means you lot again - charming) and "George and Haldi" are "another classic example.... yet more...to have a laugh at..." I hope your sides are splitting "steve" - charming :o
There is a "community" that has very few complimentary words to say about "the other site" (that's us folks). Our name is being "passed around" said esteemed "community". Cr0 is "in the process of being added" to a list "of sites that support publishing of false information". Oh my lmao ::)
Seemingly, they at rcr have knowledge and "have a good laugh" at "the individual..(and)..at the site supporting it" (that's all of us folks) with "a lack of knowledge on a subject" (yes, that's us again).
Yes, as usual, deny, confuse and ridicule rather than clarify the situation again steve. Nice one "steve" ::)
Why oh why are they STILL rambling and denying andys involvement in all of these other sites? Its enough to make ANYONE doubt that everythings kosher I imagine? ::)
Here we go steve/andy, try getting your heads around these simple questions if you would:
- Is andy in this venture for commercial gain (yes or no please)?
- If so, did he have this in mind before he became a member of cr0 (yes or no please)?
- What is the name and address of the restaurant and takeaway andy claims to get the recipes from?
- If you cant tell us, please tell us why you cant?
- Are G.Zilanee and Ali the same person (yes or no please)?
- Does andy have ANY association with any of the seven plus sites mentioned (yes or no please)?
- If so, which ones and what association?
- Has he EVER had any association with any of the seven plus sites mentioned (yes or no please)?
- If so, which ones and what association?
- Has andy transferred ownership and registration of the seven plus sites mentioned (yes or no please)?
- If so, which ones, when (dates please) and why?
- Did you, or someone you have any connection with, alter and/or deactivate the seven plus mentioned sites on 9th January (yes or no)?
- If so, why?
You'll probably choose not to clearly answer these simple questions. I think they are reasonable questions seeking to clarify the situation and add credence to your bir restaurant recipe claims on both rcr and in the ebook. But you'll probably treat them with contempt and ridicule and dismiss them as being irrelevant. In which case you only have yourselves to blame for the ongoing doubt and mistrust that you've created haven't you ::)
Again I stress that these are all my personal views and not necessarily shared by those of cr0 or its administration or owner. And noone needs to read or respond to my drivel if they don't want to. If youre not interested just ignore it
I just want clarity and honesty. But all we seem to get is smoke, mirrors and bemusing denials and deceit. I probably wont shut up until I get what I want. So you might want to lock this thread now guys it could be a very long time coming ::)
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Jeera's restaurant recommendations moved to here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html)
Other related off-topic posts deleted
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Jethro's restaurant recommendations moved to here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html)
Other related off-topic posts deleted
for crying out loud, will you stop call me Jethro, I have standards you know.
;-)
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It really does seem that the author is not a genuine character
The bit that really swayed me was, the absence of Ali fom the book credits
I think this is a book that will never be written, but always for sale
I may be more confident than you that the book will be published, or any residual credibility will be lost. They'd be doing themselves a favour by publishing a group photo and a few sentences along the lines of "who's who" for Andy and each of the other main players in this affair, too, if only to counter any ideas that it may be just a one-mand band (Andy). And give the name and address of the restaurant, of course. What would be wrong with that at this stage?
As I've said before, I'll be happy to be proved wrong on some of the 'accusations' made. But, unless each of the RCR disciples have met Andy in person and know a lot more than we do as to exactly what's going on, they have to admit it all looks a bit odd and suspicious. IMHO, Andy has only himself to blame for this, due to the way he goes about things.
Still planning on buying the book, Haldi?
Regards
George
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Jethro's restaurant recommendations moved to here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2291.0.html)
Other related off-topic posts deleted
for crying out loud, will you stop call me Jethro, I have standards you know.
;-)
Ooops! So sorry Jeera, of course you have! :P
Well, it begins with a "J" doesn't it! ;)
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I'm as much to blame (if not more) for keeping this thread going but I stand by what I said at the start of this. The more we talk about it, the more it publicises the book and RCR, and there really is no such thing as bad publicity.
And woks up I'm 100% with you but you're starting to sound a bit mental mate. Andy just can't lose, and every extra word we write, good or bad, just helps his cause.
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youre right there secret santa im as mental as a march hare in hell ::)
and errrr why do you keep writing then? ::)
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Still planning on buying the book, Haldi?
Regards
George
No, I'm not
I decided a while ago, in view of our discussion
I would love to buy a book written by a restaurant chef
I would gladly pay twenty pounds for the real thing
Even if the recipes don't work out at home, it's still somehow an insight into how it's done
I don't regret buying the "kushi" cook book or the "100 best baltis"
If I was Andy, I would say "I am genuine, and this is the name of the restaurant.Here is a picture of it, and that's me helping in the kitchens"
For that matter what on earth does he do there?
Ten years watching other people work?
Is he the driver?
Maybe he does the phone, or helps with leaflet drops?
He isn't an actual cook is he?
I wish he would say
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and errrr why do you keep writing then? ::)
Bit of a catch 22 isn't it?
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Here's the content of page 4 from the Curry Book demo:
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b191/tx55j67a/CurryBookP4.jpg)
Has anyone here ever heard of Supreme curry powder? Or is it a bit like the pursuit of a dream for the perfect hi-fi system? If a hi-fi magazine reckons a new loudspeaker cable produces MUCH better sound quality, due to it containing diamond dust or some other "new" ingredient, mixed in with the copper - some idiots go and spend a fortune, actually believing it.
Regards
George
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George and BIR members.
The Supreme brand may be hard to obtain now
see below for info from http://www.food.gov.uk/enforcement/alerts/2005/aug/supremesudan
I myself have never heard or used Supreme
but something tell's me I aint going to forget it :o
.............................................................
A product withdrawal has been issued in respect of Supreme brand Coriander Powder, Hot Curry Powder and Mild Curry Powder, due to contamination with the illegal dyes Sudan I and IV.
Sudan I and IV are not permitted colours under the Colours in Food Regulations 1995. They are considered to be genotoxic carcinogens and their presence, at any level is not permitted in foodstuffs for any purpose.
The affected products were packed by Lubna Food Ltd, which has undertaken a product withdrawal of the affected items.
The products being withdrawn are:
Supreme brand - Batch Code 031201
100g Coriander Powder, BBE Dec 06
400g Hot Curry Powder, BBE Dec 06
400g Mild Curry Powder, BBE Dec 06
100g Mild Curry Powder, BBE Dec 06
100g Hot Curry Powder, BBE Dec 06
No other Supreme Brand products are known to be affected.
A copy of the Lubna Foods Ltd point-of-sale notice is attached to this food alert.
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To be fair Graeme, we should probably point out that the notice was issued in August 2005.
I presume that this particular issue would have been resolved long ago.
I have also never heard of, or seen, "Supreme" products. That doesn't mean to say that they don't exist, or aren't used in BIRs, of course.
I see that they are a small company, based in Bradford, owned (or represented) by a MR A EBRAHIM: http://www.alibaba.com/company/10383790.html (http://www.alibaba.com/company/10383790.html)
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To be fair Graeme, we should probably point out that the notice was issued in August 2005.
I presume that this particular issue would have been resolved long ago.
Yeah i saw that on google too. Pretty much all of the spice companies had to discontinue items it seems.
I think i saw a couple of supreme spices in banglacity, east london. They were only in 5kg sacks. They make cheap table salt and their logo isnt anything to do with india or spices. Could well be another company as i'm only certain the salt was supreme.
Other than that i havent seen it in the rest of the shops, of which there are huge amounts.
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The restaurant may well use Supreme curry powder and/or other Supreme brand ingredients, which then begs a few further questions:
How come it's suddenly mentioned that Supreme powders are used? Andy started posting here, making out he was revealing all from 10 years connection of some sort with a restaurant. There's never been any mention of more than one restaurant. Why didn't he mention Supreme ingredients before?
How many recipes does this guy have for each dish whether it be base sauce or each finished dish? He made out here, that his were the established recipes used by the restaurant. It isn't feasible, in my view, that so many new recipes would suddenly be introduced by the restaurant, within such a short period of time. If the Curry Book recipes are the 'real deal' then he may have been deceiving us here - fobbing us off with other recipes when he knew the 'real' ones were being held back for the book. Either way, it doesn't look good.
He also maintained it was essential to make huge batches of base sauce, as per his recipes, and that smaller quantities (scaled down pro-rata) would simply not work. I never did buy this idea, but he insisted it was crucial. I bet the Curry Book uses smaller quantities, faced with the commercial realisation that most potential buyers of the book will simply not want to make industrial quantities of base sauce or anything else.
Regards
George
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Has anyone here ever heard of Supreme curry powder?
Funny enough one of the few places you can buy them from is the RCR online store, thats a bit of luck ::)
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Has anyone here ever heard of Supreme curry powder?
This is from one of my posts earlier in this thread George.
Oh and by the way, don't you think it's just a tad suspicious that Anne, a moderator, is the mouthpiece/owner of the RCR spice suppliers? Did you not find it weird that the latest attempt at BIR replication needed a particular brand of curry mix that is not (generally) available to the British public, but is surprisingly easily available from the RCR spice shop?
Also if you read RCR you would have seen that his alternative to this proprietary brand was almost word for word a copy of a Pat Chapman curry powder which he claimed he had spent a lot of time researching and phoning his contacts in the trade to obtain!
What always amuses me with Andy is how the bloke thinks he can just rip off other people's recipes and present them in virtually the exact same form and yet not get pulled up for it. What a mug.
Just one more nail in his coffin isn't it?
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Also if you read RCR you would have seen that his alternative to this proprietary brand was almost word for word a copy of a Pat Chapman curry powder which he claimed he had spent a lot of time researching and phoning his contacts in the trade to obtain! What always amuses me with Andy is how the bloke thinks he can just rip off other people's recipes and present them in virtually the exact same form and yet not get pulled up for it. What a mug. Just one more nail in his coffin isn't it?
I agree. I think our questions and criticisms are valid and for Andy to disprove if he can rather than anyone saying we're just being nasty for the sake of it. Something else I can't start to believe is that a manufacturer of a proprietary blend like curry powder would diviluge the mix/recipe to anyone, beyond what they're forced to print on the packet. It would be like phoning McDonalds to ask for the recipe for their Big Mac sauce, or KFC for the mix to make the chicken coating - they would NEVER tell you.
Regards
George
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You'll probably choose not to clearly answer these simple questions. I think they are reasonable questions seeking to clarify the situation and add credence to your bir restaurant recipe claims on both rcr and in the ebook. But you'll probably treat them with contempt and ridicule and dismiss them as being irrelevant. In which case you only have yourselves to blame for the ongoing doubt and mistrust that you've created haven't you
Oh the silence is deafening. And doesnt it speak volumes ::)
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And apparently rcr is "the fastest growing indian community on the internet" with over 5500 members now ::)
They welcome the likes of "Jinesversinger", "Neupquerycapy", "Opebsistuptuh" (presumably from Nigeria ::)), "UphoxiaponRip", "encantoghehido (Ethiopia?) and so on. I could go on and name another 5000 plus similar common names but ill spare you the tedium ::)
And some of the names are really so obscure as to be unbelievable such as the ones who actually post "CurryCanuck", "Channa Doll", "adminAndy", "IanR", "King Prawn" etc ::)
Who is this guy really trying to kid ::)
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Or the same could be said to you Woks Up, LesDJ, CA, Ba Ba Black Sheep, Nandaloo, Not In It For The Money Oh No, Wizzler or whatever you are posing as today !
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hahahahh, you're really funny IanR roflamo
I never knew I was so many schizophrenic characters ;D
Whilst im really flattered Im sure many of those people will be truly insulted :P
At least all the names make sense though hey ;)
Anyway its totally besides the point ian. Im not claiming to have recipes from a restaurant that has been in existance for 10 years plus now am i ::)
Nor am i trying to get 15 quid a pop for an ebook off the back of that claim am i
Nor does it answer the questions i posed does it
Try and keep up with the plot mate, hey ::)
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If anyones interested it appears this ebook is coming out tomorrow, funny enough demand is so HIGH that there will be a queue for the downloads. I'm fairly sure that the queue is likely to be made up of the four members of RCR that are actually real so don't expect to wait to long before your are parted from your money ;)
Another note of interest is that it appears this is just volume 1 so get ready to hand out another 15 pounds in the very near future, what a surprise ::)
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No one got it then, it's hardly surprising for 15 pounds and the fact that it must have some sort of malware in it. According to the T&C's you can't print it until you are deemed safe to be allowed a print option! Also if you print it then scan it in and publish it on the web they will know and deactivate your ebook, not quite sure how they are going to do that. EDIT I've just seen that there is a hidden code on each page that only they can see it's invisible to everyone else, I'm sure a scanner is going to pick that up then ;D
I'm more interested to know if the name of the restaurant is in it than the recipes, if it is who's up for going ;D
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As they seem to be ?experts? as securing the document by various watermarks perhaps their time would be better spent concentrating and selling internet security ;D
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At the time of writing, this thread has had 2647 views
And no one's bought the book?
Is it the price?
All I really want to know, is which restaurant the recipes come from
Surely some RCR members view this site too
So please, someone tell me
Is there a genuine restaurant credited?
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Ianr's sarcastic comment about the ebook on rcr:
I noticed on the website (the currybook website) that there is a cashback offer for recommendations. I'll see if our friend Woks Up want's a copy If he hasn't bought it already
So i naturally assumed he was giving it to me for free:
Oh, and im still waiting for my free copy of the curry book that ianr so kindly said hed get for me
and ianr's sarcastic reply on rcr:
Latest news from No2 site is that apparently I am supplying them with a copy of the book
he's even got a smilie at the end saying "im with stupid". Yes Ian, i think you probably are ::)
i sure wouldnt pay for a copy ::)
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At the time of writing, this thread has had 2647 views
And no one's bought the book?
Is it the price?
All I really want to know, is which restaurant the recipes come from
Surely some RCR members view this site too
So please, someone tell me
Is there a genuine restaurant credited?
Seems not then haldi ::)
Adminandy/admin have this to say about these things on rcr:
The melting base recipes on the forum are a derivative of the "Savoury and Mild" based recipes and form a set of recipes from the businesses associated at the time to Ali
So ali used to be associated with "the restaurant" and "the takeaway" but isnt any more. Would you credit it huh? ::)
The Ebook recipes and website have no connection to Ali at all
Therefore the ebook recipes are not from "the restaurant' and "the takeaway" that ali used to be associated with. Who would have thought huh? ::)
I am not going to talk about business information openly on this forum
LMAO of course hes not, he presumably wants to weave an even bigger tangled web of apparent deceipt, deception and lies than he already seems to have done
it is just safe to say that a full set of the melting base recipes (not the ebook recipes) will be provided on the forum as used by the chefs of the relevant businesses associated at the time with Ali
Can you believe it :o. "safe to say" ROFLMAO The inference is that there are NEW and DIFFERENT restaurants and takeaways now that ali is part of and yet MORE melting base recipes. What a joke.
I used to think that andy was content removed as inappropriate by CA. Now i can see hes also content removed as inappropriate by CA that takes everyone else for one. Unfortunately it seems that some people are more than happy to comply
There are similarities between the melting base recipes and the recipes in the ebook although the differences give each one their characteristic individuality (as restaurant to restaurant)
What the hell is he on about :-\. Taking lessons in unplain english from others on his site i see ;D.
What he means i think is that there is no restaurant or takeway, hes made it all up and hes changed the recipes once again ::)
the currybook website is a commercial venture with owners and sponsors
ROFLMO So he finally admits the truth then
The currybook website will have it's own forum for all purchasers of the book giving everyone who buys the book the opportunity to discuss the recipes and talk with the actual chefs
OFFS he just cant help himself can he ::)
Of course it will. Oh joyful rcr members lmao. They have to go and join that one too. Why not pay to download some vidoes (that are not of ali's restaurant or takweway because hes no longer associated with them) whilst your about it lol
They (thats all of us) just have not got a clue who owns what, who works for who and more so how many restaurants are involved and such it goes on. They can keep asking questions on there but no-one is going to answer them are they!
yep, that just about sums the whole sorry and sordid affair up doesnt it ::)
And lets not forget the following:
The other site (thats us) are then going to have a trip out to the restaurant to see Andy and Ali face to face. Well lets be right, may be a car full and then they would not see Andy and Ali, well not if they go to the restaurant mentioned in the book anyway!!
Oh what a BIG surprise that is then ::)
Hell, even im bored with it all now.
Please delete these threads or lock them admin. Andys gone well beyond a joke now surely.
And still they will blindly follow ::)
All opinions are mine and mine alone of course however mental i may seem ;)
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What he means i think is that there is no restaurant or takeway, hes made it all up and hes changed the recipes once again ::)
At the end of the day, this is probably my conclusion too, UNTIL PROVEN OTHERWISE. This is my 'balance of probability' conclusion verging on 'beyond reasonable doubt'. The simple reason is all the apprarent subterfuge, excuses, runarounds, recipe changes, extreme 'security measures' and all the rest of it. The latest thing I don't like is how they make out that his forum is the only forum of its type and how no other book has revealed BIR type recipes. What about Curry Secret and Kushi Balti books, notwithstanding any shortcomings? BUT I'M WILLING TO BE PROVED WRONG. Is anyone in a position to try the new book's base sauce and one of the recipes like Chicken Madras or CTM, to see what the end result is like. 15 pounds seems an awful lot of money for an eBook, especially when you're not even allowed to print it.
Regards
George
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Andys gone well beyond a joke now surely.
And still they will blindly follow ::)
Woks Up, out of all that ramble, and it was a good ramble, the quote above is the most significant point. It's not Andy that's the problem, it's that strange tiny clan that follow on his every word as if it were Gospel. What does it take to reveal the truth to them?
Now you know how religious sects get started.
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Now you know how religious sects get started.
:o I've never had religious sex before, is it any good Santa? :P
Andys gone well beyond a joke now surely.
And still they will blindly follow ::)
I thought it was beyond a joke months ago ::) It's pure arse-gravy (my opinion only)....I wonder how much time people will allow both Andy and his claims to remain unsubstatiated before just a shadow of doubt begins to enter their minds.
BTW - I've been away a while, could someone tell me if I missed the Sunday supplement article? or the latest excuse for why it's delayed? :-X ;D
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I wonder how much time people will allow both Andy and his claims to remain unsubstatiated before just a shadow of doubt begins to enter their minds.
There's this song, if you don't know it it'll mean nothing to you, but if you do it pretty much tells the story of RCR and its dumb followers. It goes something like this...
Isn't it grand! Isn't it fine! Look at the cut, the style, the line!
RCR is all together
But all together, it's all together
The most remarkable travesty that I have ever seen.
These eyes of mine at once determined
The bhaji's mingin, the balti's vermin
The garlic's blue and the members are a lovely shade of green.
Somebody send for the Beer.
I'm feeling a litle bit queer!
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posted by unclebuck
so i bought a copy of the much debated ebook "thecurrybook" and have to say its very interesting a bit pricey but curiosity got the better of me and got a ebook. it goes into good detail and with good pics. much of the same, as in base gravy and pre cooking meat... but this book dose use a "spiced water" for the base gravy??
but proof is in the cooking and I'm going get cooking now.
just for the record I'm not going to post the books recipes as i feel its just not fair on the book owner(and legal reasons), but i will give a honest review.
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posted by curry king
Great stuff UB, a decent, honest review is what is needed.
I think the spice water was used in Andys other recipes but can't wait to hear what you have to say about the rest of it.
Any chance you could see if the tikka marinade is anything like this one:
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,874.0.html
The sample recipe was very similar so be interesting to see what has been used.
Thanks
cK
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posted by unclebuck
hi CK, it is similar but a little different too. not tryed it yet. i have tryed blades and it is bang on.
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posted by curry king
Sounds interesting, look forward to the review.
Cheers
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posted by secret santa
If this is Andy's book you are referring to, you have to wonder after all the kerfuffle and hooha and numerous changes to the curries on RCR to achieve the exact BIR replica, why did he then make a book with this new geezer who isn't ali and totally deny any relationship between the book and RCR? What does this say about the curries presented as the definitive BIR replicas on RCR? It beggars belief!
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posted by unclebuck
so i bought a copy of the much debated ebook "thecurrybook"
That's great UB, I look forward to seeing your review of it.
In the meantime, please would you confirm that it discloses the names and addresss of the restaurant and takeway and the names of the owners and chefs? If so, what are they please?
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BTW - I've been away a while, could someone tell me if I missed the Sunday supplement article? or the latest excuse for why it's delayed? :-X ;D
Welcome back Domi :)
No Sunday supplement article OR excuses Domi, as far as I'm aware. Just no mention of it. Are you suprised? Maybe Ali is still proof reading if for errors? Or maybe the forum needs upgrading again to accommodate it? ;)
Or maybe there IS no restaurant or takeaway or Ali, and therefore, no Sunday supplement article? ::)
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I personally think Andy is just buying time until he manages to find a takeaway that he can talk into joining his money-making scheme......I'd not waste ?15 on a book by such a character - not unless I could have a full culinary history of the man and his restaurant(s). I've tried Andy's recipes and found them sadly lacking, whereas I've tried other recipes from "non-catering establishment" members and had far far better results and half the hassle in cooking them (besides the fact that some recipes seem to change almost as often as the page refreshes). :-\ ???
Andy's reticence to proffer any kind of concrete proof of who's what's and where's is most alarming, especially when his credibility is so openly questioned. Why is it that Anne (or Annedy as I call them) is the only person who has ever been told the whereabouts of Ali's restaurant? I dunno why but when I think of Annedy the only image I see is Ronnie Barker wearing a dress on one half and a suit down the other. :o
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I'm itching to know if it's any good...
It does look like us lot at cr0 should have probably learned by now though...
My prediction is that it comes out ok. It will have roughly correct techniques and ingredients and probably produce a curry I'd eat. However, I think that will be the extent of it.
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Hi Cory Ander
I just wondered why if you and others were so keen to know if the restaurant is named, why you haven't purchased the book to find out?
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Hi Bernie,
I know that you're a staunch fan of Andy and RCR but, nevertheless, I do wonder why you think that I might possibly shell out 15 quid for a recipe book (an unprintable e-book at that), that I don't actually want, when all I want to know is the names and addresses of the alledged restaurant and takeaway (and the names of the owners and chefs) which we were led to believe it included? :-\
It's a bit like buying a packet of (pretty expensive!) cereals, just to find out what the ingredients are, isn't it? :P
I presume that SOMEONE has bought the book (like you for instance?) and is in a position to freely share this information with us? It's not the "BIG SECRET" is it? It sure isn't copyright is it? So what's the big deal about disclosing it?
Unless it doesn't contain that information of course? ::)
Frankly, Andy has more secrets than a thousand Indian restaurants combined! Come on Bernie, save me 15 quid and spill the beans, you know you want to! ;)
Besides, with all this free advertising, I think we deserve some commission. Maybe Andy would like to donate a free copy so we can give it a fair critique. ;)
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hi CA. i can not disclose any info in the book. i have been contacted to reconfirm that any info from in the book will terminate my ebook. sorry mate.
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OK so made the madras recipe with all the pre cooking (chicken, base gravy etc)follow to the letter and I'm really disappointed with it. it smelt really fantastic, just like the real thing but and it is a BIG but it tasted really bland. i cant tell you how disappointed i was after all the effort involved.. if i had to give it a score out of ten i would give it a five... :'( .
considering the recipes Ive try-ed from this site get about 9!...but theres a-lot more to the book then just the madras, starters and sides are all there too so hope yet..
Not had time to try any other recipes yet but will let you guys know.
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Sounds as if teh recipes are as elaborate as ever then, thanks for letting us know. It's a shame you can't discuss further on the ebook, I can just imagine back at the lair...
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thats funny CK ;D.
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hi CA. i can not disclose any info in the book. Andy is reading this and has contacted me to reconfirm that any info from in the book will terminate my ebook. sorry mate.
Andy, if you are reading this, I have to say that that's a pretty short-sighted point of view if you're really trying to build a business around selling e-books. Would you take the same approach if the e-book was to be reviewed by Ziff-Davis, the Register, or the New York Times? I would certainly doubt it.
From a business perspective, what you want to do is convince people how great the content is. Word of mouth (positive or negative) is the best/worst publicity you can get. It has been proven time and time again to be much better than any marketing or advertising campaign that you could spend money on. If people who are honest and upstanding (as UB seems to be since he promised that he wouldn't post recipes here) can't write an independent review of your product, that speaks volumes about the quality and sustainability of your product as well as your overall business plan.
You may make a few sales and you may even get a few happy customers, but it isn't a sustainable model. Without a sustainable business model, are you (as a business) even going to be around long enough to ensure that people's ebooks continue to work?
That's a pretty big risk to ask potential customers to take and really reinforces the perspective of a "take the money and run" operation.
I'm offering the above to you, Andy, as free advice on how you can build a better business. You can take it or leave it, but this type of advice is part of what I do professionally, so I'm not just saying this to waste bandwidth and deplete the world's energy reserves to ferry these particular electrons around the planet.
Hopefully, you'll reconsider and let people like UB, who are one of your most important assets, e.g. paying customers, give a review of the book. If he violates the terms and posts recipes, then that's a different matter, but unless some sort of legally-binding, industrial-strength NDA was part of the click-wrap agreement, let the man speak!
If you don't believe me, why not try asking the record companies and movie studios how far they've gotten with treating their customers like criminals using DRM strategies preventing straight-forward and legitimate use of the content they've paid for? It isn't exactly a strategy that's likely to win friends and positively influence potential customers to shell out their cold, hard cash for something that you're preventing legitimate users from talking about.
Cheers,
ast
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I have far far too much time on my hands!!! I have spent the evening surfing when I should be working!! Lol
A is from the curry book
http://www.thecurrybook.com/joomla/images/stories/curry/DSCI0304.JPG
B is not!
http://www.yellowtom.co.uk/2559
Enjoy!! SBF
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Impressive detective work Slim.
Is there anyone close by that can do the honours and determine if this place cooks up a decent curry ?
Sonali Restaurant
20 Bridge Street, Tadcaster, North Yorkshire,
LS24 9AL
Tel: 01937 530607
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I have far far too much time on my hands!!! I have spent the evening surfing when I should be working!!
Wow! I'm impressed that you managed to find this. The first question must be whether Sonali Restaurant know anything about the book or whether it's just some random photo.
I'm sorry to hear the same old story again, like with other books which promised the world before, i.e now the first review of The Curry Book sounds disappointing in terms of the taste of the food produced.
If the book was reported as being half-decent, like The Kushi Balti Book was, I might pay 10 pounds for a printed book but not 15 pounds for an eBook where they may be able to 'turn it off' on any kind of whim. The authors/publishers must be control freaks.
Regards
George
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Very impressive work there slimboyfat. As you have the book I assume the address is not given then (answer seems obvious but I'm asking all the same)?
Anyway seems like me and the other 30 odd blokes from the rugby club have our next winners-celebration' venue sorted. Just have to book as the local bible-reading chapter. :)
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No ! i don't have the book !! and i don't intend to pay ?15 for it either !! ::)
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SBF - Am I missing something, or is the first photo now of some green chillis?
Interesting, Woks Up also had some problems with websites being changed as he spoke ;)
Did you rather intend to post this photo (Top), found on the currybook website, for comparison with the one you found on the web directory (Bottom)?
UB - I appreciate your dilemma there. I'm astounded that Andy would send you such a pathetic and draconian threat just for mentioning the name of the restaurant! :o And I thought he claimed that there ARE no curry secrets! ;D ::)
PS: Please take special note of my use of smilies. Apprantly they look just like those that Woks Up (and everybody else) uses ::) Please can we have a greater variety Stew? ;)
Don't worry, I'm probably talking rubbish, as I normally do, please forgive me people! ;D
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CA
When this was first posted earlier, the first photo link was to the restaurant (at Christmas) as you've now posted. The second photo link was as it is now. The first link has since been changed to the green chillies.
???
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Yes, sounds like the actions of someone, with nothing to hide, doesn't it ::)
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Whoops too late - cats out the bag eh?
;D
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The other one to check out is Cottage of India here: http://www.cottageofindia.net-menu.co.uk/ (http://www.cottageofindia.net-menu.co.uk/)
Cottageofindia was one of Andy's log on names (both here and on RCR).
A web search throws up just one Indian takeaway (or restaurant) of that name:
Cottage of India
40 Kirkgate
TADCASTER
01937 835021
Perhaps someone can check this one out too? It's only just up the road from the Sonali. Just ask for Andy...or Ali...or Anne...or
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I think Andy's photo's date is a photoshop job, as the BIR looks more modern now - unless they've had a bit of a refurb since xmas. The chairs have been re upholstered, and the legs have changed shade from dark wood to far lighter. Also, the non Andy photo's window has changed from an old fashioned stained varnish mahogany look to something a bit fresher. The views outside (albeit at slightly different angles) are quite different too if you look closely / zoom in. I think these two pictures ARE from the same place but possible at very different times. The big 'S' logo is also missing in Andy's one.
A discrete "does this voucher I have for 10 percent off I got online work - oh I see you have a new sign in the window" reveals that it's been under new ownership for "quite a while".... The guy seemed nice though - strong Indian accent. Oh Andy and the lengths he goes to! ;D
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With that in mind it's pointless going now. However, if you do still decide to go along, this voucher does still work ;D
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/gallery/3840_02_02_08_11_58_27.JPG)
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Sounds as if teh recipes are as elaborate as ever then, thanks for letting us know. It's a shame you can't discuss further on the ebook, I can just imagine back at the lair...
Laser in position! Now the kind gentlemen told me it's just above the barbers shop so don't let's set the laser to penetrate too deep. On that note, having just seen Sweeney Todd tonight, I'm glad the barber is underneath and not the other way around... Can you imagine Andys next pre cooked meat method!!! :o "Find yourself one portly stranger......."
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/gallery/3840_03_02_08_12_12_40.JPG)
Excuse the graphics, my gf's laptop only has paint, otherwise there would have also been a very realistic "fire" button and perhaps some other amusing options.
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I'm tempted to get a copy, just for the hell of it, so I can report as much as possible without going as far as breaching copyright law. It will be a challenge to take some kind of backup, long before they realise who's copy it is and 'turn me off'. It would be saying something if the CIA could do that. I mean, would you have to be connected to the Internet just for the wretched eBook to open and function? Has anyone ever heard of such extreme and ridiculous control measures for any other eBook, especially if you've paid a whopping 15 pounds?
I won't buy it myself, of course. I'll reimburse a friend to, with no connections to, or interest in Indian food websites whatsoever.
If one can read it, then I'm fairly certain I can take a backup.
Regards
George
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I'm tempted to get a copy, just for the hell of it, so I can report as much as possible without going as far as breaching copyright law. It will be a challenge to take some kind of backup, long before they realise who's copy it is and 'turn me off'. It would be saying something if the CIA could do that. I mean, would you have to be connected to the Internet just for the wretched eBook to open and function? Has anyone ever heard of such extreme and ridiculous control measures for any other eBook, especially if you've paid a whopping 15 pounds?
I won't buy it myself, of course. I'll reimburse a friend to, with no connections to, or interest in Indian food websites whatsoever.
If one can read it, then I'm fairly certain I can take a backup.
Regards
George
George could you not just take a series of screen captures and save these to files?
My bet is that this e-book probably won't have copyrights anyway. This costs money and I doubt he would have done that.
;D
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George could you not just take a series of screen captures and save these to files?
My bet is that this e-book probably won't have copyrights anyway. This costs money and I doubt he would have done that.
I won't say how I reckon I could get around any protection measures in case it helps him thwart my efforts. But, suffice it to say, even if I had to handwrite-out every word of text, it must be very simple to get around almost anything he could think up.
Whilst you have to pay for a registered trademark or patent, I believe copyright is automatic and doesn't need to be registered or paid for.
Regards
George
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Whilst you have to pay for a registered trademark or patent, I believe copyright is automatic and doesn't need to be registered or paid for.
In that case it would be interesting to know how much information he's taken off this site.
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This is interesting. You've got 6 hours to decide whether the purchase is what you expected - or you are entitled to a full refund. (PURCHASE not purchse)
Item 5 is also interesting. What the hell is "pre-determined time". These are not legal terms of purchase.
Terms Of Purchase.
Written by admin
Tuesday, 22 January 2008
IMPORTANT TERMS OF PURCHSE.
1. When purchasing any of the products you should note the following. If you do not agree then please do not purchase.
2. If after purchase you decide the product is not what you expected you may ask for a refund. We will refund your purchase up to 6 hours after your purchase. You must email us within this time frame.Refunding the product purchased will de-activate the product and your licence key will expire immediately.
3. Please give accurate details where requested. You should not use a temporary email address or any throw-away email addresses or false names etc as the system checks your details regularly and will automatically de-activate the product if incorrect or missing information is found.
4. On each page of the Ebook is embeded a code which represents your license information. This is only readable by ourselves and to everyone else it is invisible to the eye. Should any attempt be made to copy the software, use screen capturing software or place the software or it's contents on any other site then your purchased copy will de-activate itself and lock itself rendering the software unuseable. This constitutes software piracy and will result in action. We will not then re-activate your software.
5. You will after a pre-determined time be allowed to print pages from the book for ease of use. Upon activation of the print function, no refunds will then be entertained. Please remember that your license is embedded in the software and can be seen by us if then placed on the internet.
6. You may receive at times a new registration key. This will replace the registration key being used. Full instructions will be given.
7. You may move the software to any machine you have at home, however only one copy can be active at once. You will need therefore to unistall the copy on one machine to move it to another and visa versa. This is a simple process and takes a matter of minutes.
8. Your activation key must be kept private. If you give the activation key to someone else then our system will recognise this and de-activate all attempts at using the key including your original purchased copy. We cannot re-activate your original copy. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.
Should you have any questions then please email sales@thecurrybook.comThis e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it before purchasing.
Last Updated ( Wednesday, 23 January 2008 )
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There can be little doubt that the sonali is the restaurant and the cottage of india is the takeaway that andy claims his recipes are from. The postive news for andy is that at least there are a restaurant and takeaway somewhere in the picture. The questions that remain are:
- is andy (or ali) associated with them in any way
- if so how
- are andys/rcrs/thecurrybooks recipes from these places as andy claims
- are the curries from these places actually any good
- do andys recipes faithfully reproduce them
God dont you just love a good mystery agatha christie couldnt do a better job ::)
Sorry ca there goes that bloody smilie again :P
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Re: copyright, there are a number of different ways to register copyright. The easiest is to publish something in a widely accessible place with the words "Copyright YYYY NAME_OF_COPYRIGHT_HOLDER" or you can alternatively use the "c in a circle" symbol. You can also post a copy of something to yourself so that it gets dated, and then only open it in the event of any dispute. Formal registration for copyright does take some time, but it doesn't cost all that much.
However....
The above reflects the US copyright law, which also includes a "fair use" clause to allow you to quote or use parts (not the whole work) in critiques, parodies, and other scenarios. I almost added this to my other post, but then I discovered that UK copyright law is quite different and doesn't include the "fair use" clause. Wikipedia also says that copyright is "automatic" in the UK, but that isn't much of a legal description of how it works. You could also say that about some of the US methods too.
Re: ebook security, my guess (having not seen the book) is that the executable is really just a front-end for an embedded web browser. If SBF got the pictures off the web, and it seems that you need to be connected to use it, then it's just providing automatic authentication to the website. Given a copy of the ebook and appropriate network diagnostic tools, I'm sure it wouldn't take too much to figure out how it works.
Like any security scheme, there's always at least one way around it. That's the thing about security, as I'm sure SnS knows well from his former military background as well. The trick is to make it inconvenient enough so that you can achieve an appropriate level of risk mitigation. There will always be people who try and get around it.
In this case, hand transcriptions, digital photos of the screen and probably any of the "really good" screen capture tools would likely work quite well. Sorry, Andy, but there's always a way. The other thing which is quite amusing is that most people don't really understand information security techniques well enough to come up with something that really works. There are a few techniques which are generally accepted by the InfoSec community to work really well, but it doesn't sound like these are actually being employed in the ebook. It seems more like a "home grown" approach, and nearly always, these only provide the illusion of security rather than actually doing much good.
If I had 15 quid to throw away and a few hours, I'd buy it for the craic just to see how it worked. Information Security and Assurance is another aspect of what I do professionally, so I have some basis for these comments as well.
I think the 6 hr refund policy is crap. Are you really going to be able to make all the dishes (or even one of them) in 6 hrs from the time of purchase to determine if you don't feel like you got what you paid for? I agree with SnS. I don't think there'd be much of a legal foundation for those terms and conditions if someone pushed very hard.
At least the recent developments on this thread finally made me chuckle a bit. It seemed to be giving diminishing returns earlier.
As P.T. Barnum said, "There's a sucker born every minute."
ast
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These are not legal terms of purchase.
Good point. Perhaps the eBook is classified as software and I guess software is exempt from distant selling regulations - something like 7 days to make your mind up, but not if you've opened the software, presumably.
Woks Up - yes, there are still a good few remaining questions. It would have been so easy for Andy to play the honest broker and outline his situation up front, without giving too much away if he didn't want to. We would have understood that, rather than the smoke screen which has been put up.
Regards
George
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I'm tempted to get a copy, just for the hell of it, so I can report as much as possible without going as far as breaching copyright law. It will be a challenge to take some kind of backup, long before they realise who's copy it is and 'turn me off'. It would be saying something if the CIA could do that. I mean, would you have to be connected to the Internet just for the wretched eBook to open and function? Has anyone ever heard of such extreme and ridiculous control measures for any other eBook, especially if you've paid a whopping 15 pounds?
I won't buy it myself, of course. I'll reimburse a friend to, with no connections to, or interest in Indian food websites whatsoever.
If one can read it, then I'm fairly certain I can take a backup.
Regards
George
hi George,
yes you need to been connected to the INTERNET for it to work. you cant copy it mate, its encrypted with software.
http://www.file-secure.com/
you cant print it ether not yet anyway which is a complete bummer as most people who don't have there PC next to there hob.
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I have added a little something to the downloads section that MAY help!
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Following UB's link, I stand partially corrected. It's a bit more sophisticated than I thought from the earlier descriptions, but the product in question certainly uses liberal amounts of FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) to sell the product to people who don't really understand the issues. Since it works on a minimum subscription fee of $67/month, I'm guessing this is why the e-book is so expensive.
After you cut through all the hype, the File Secure Pro product uses the built-in security features of the PDF file format specification as well as seemingly using some embedded JavaScript (as I think someone else mentioned) to provide real-time checks to the File Secure servers to ensure that the copy hasn't been deactivated. The techniques are essentially the same as one of the ways used by your browser to make sure the security certificates on "https" websites haven't expired.
That said, it still won't stop hand transcriptions or taking pictures of the screen. I'm sure it isn't supporting any accessibility features for screen readers either, so I still stand by my earlier comments about treating customers as criminals isn't a sound business practice.
For me, even if it was to provide the best BIR recipes on the planet, I don't think it'd be worth it when you have sites like this and documented proof that many real chefs are willing to help the home cook by providing recipes and tips. There isn't any such thing as the "silver bullet" that provides the "one true way" to solve complex problems in business or technology, so I don't put much faith in claims that there's one for BIR cooking.
I think I'll spend the 15 quid on ingredients for my next batch of base. It'll provide a much better return on investment than an ebook surrounded by so much hype and so little proof of substance.
ast
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Quote from
http://www.file-secure.com/
mentioned in uncklebuck's post
"CIA-Strength Security Software Stops Thieves And 'Scum-Sucking Rip-Off Artists'
If that's the case it clearly doesn't work very well as it manage to let Andy use it.
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Assuming that the recipes are based on those at the Sonali restaurant, the priority must be to go there unannounced for a meal. I would if I lived closer. If the food is amongst the best BIR cuisine in taste terms, then that MAY bode well for the book, if they've been honest in writing out and testing the recipes.
But if the Sonali food is lacklustre, like so many BIRs these days, then who's bothered if the book contains accurate renditions of the recipes. We wouldn't want to make lacklustre food, anyway.
Regards
George
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...one more thing
While it should've been obvious from my earlier post, what happens when Andy Inc. or whomever gets tired of paying the ~800 quid a year to keep the e-book working? Doing the math, the minimum costs for the security software are 804/yr, meaning he must sell at least 27 e-books a year to pay for the security measures. Depending on how he manages his P&L, it might not matter...
BUT, if he gets tired of paying the subscription fee for whatever reason: e-book-y no work-y!
Buyer beware!
ast
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Noboby seems to have mentioned that the picture could be a rip off, and let's face it, given Andy's record that's quite likely. So this may not be the restaurant at all (assuming there is a restuarant and even that's in doubt).
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Just one point.. It looks like all the files are stored on the file secure server and not downloaded as a whole (According to the file secure web page)
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While it should've been obvious from my earlier post
Yes the consequnces were pretty obvious ast. What's equally obvious is that if I buy a book it lasts forever if treated well. In the same vein as your post, is he really going to pay that subscription forever?
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And talking of books, isn't Andy bringing out a printed version very soon? It's going to be interesting to see how he protects that from being copied. Muahahahahhahaah.
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It's only a 51 minute drive from my door to theirs :D Although obviously I shan't disclose when we'll be visiting ::) IS anyone else planning a visit?
BTW, PDF is ridiculously easy to replicate with or without encoding ;) (apologies to the smiliephobic members ::) ). Has anyone actually bought the ebook? :-\
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Noboby seems to have mentioned that the picture could be a rip off
No, but I did mention that it is under new management (hence the big 'S' in the window of the non Andy picture), so we'll never find out. :(
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So if it's under new management does that mean it is or it isn't the restaurant from Andy's book? I'm confused now.
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So if it's under new management does that mean it is or it isn't the restaurant from Andy's book? I'm confused now.
It means that it may have been but is now almost certainly not. I think it quite likely that Andy used this photo knowing that the BIR had changed hands, so no-one could then verify his story either way, unless they could contact the old management.
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I think it quite likely that Andy used this photo knowing that the BIR had changed hands, so no-one could then verify his story either way...
Do you really think Andy could be that devious, sneaky and crawl out from under a rock, underhanded? :)
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Ok,
It?s back to sleuth mode if you Google ?Gajee Zilanee? you only get one result and that is for a licence to sell alcohol and is not for the restaurant on Bridge Street
The licensee for the the premises at 20 Bridge Street is a Mr Peer Zilanee (current)
I have trawled the electoral register for a ?Gajee Zilanee? but cannot find one anywhere the uk !
I can find Peer and Kutub who both live in the same house on STRATFORD STREET NORTH (I have the full address and phone number if anyone wants to call them)
SBF
P.I
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the plot thickens...
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I would like to draw this to a close and lock the thread.
I think we all know the underlying reasons why RCR was set up, I think we all know the people who defected are too far gone with their lies to ever come back.
Anyhow lets concentrate on developing this site into the resource it should be.
As for RCR being the fastest growing site well, anyone can let internet bots register on their forum to gain 6000 members quickly, i would have 60,000 members now if i did the same. This forum is about activity, quality posts and variety of recipes. Not a one man show to leverage cash out of its unsuspecting members.
I wont even go into the threatening emails i have received off RCR over the months to sue me for copyright, what a joke. I might post them up at some stage for all of you and the RCR defectors to see what Andy is really like.
Thread Closed
Stew 8)