It's tougher than Lamb so I hear? But then cooking beef is beyond that. I know for a fact my Rogan Josh has Goat in it. It's lighter in colour, almost pink and definitely changes the dish as all meats do.

Here's the thing. Where I am no one can decide on what Mutton is? Yeah you can read Libraries on this but many, even local Indian people get confused when you ask them because its just meat to them or I am asking the wrong questions? Apparently Mutton is an older Lamb, Approx 3 years. (Which I prefer poor sod). Lamb is  a yearling, then comes Mr. Goat who is present in a lot of dishes but called Lamb in some places. I don't figure it, or didn't until recently.

Yah know? If some nice restaurant would have told me what was going on I would not have had to spend 10 years figuring out what is happening and why? Fact is the journey was good and I know my spices but THEY are the masters of it.

Anyway I'm at last enjoying my food but it shouldn't be this hard for anyone truly.  :
Thanks Bobby.  ;D

Quote from: Bobby Bhuna on December 23, 2009, 07:47 PM
Anyway, he doesn't like lamb, but he said he does like mutton. Eventually it turns out that in Pakistan, they call Goat's meat mutton. He says it's lighter than lamb and really soft with a milder smell and flavour. It's the meat of choice back home for him. I'm trying to source some. Do you know how to cook it?

Cheers

BB

Hi Bobby thanks for looking at it. I don't want to flood the forum on this because there are some great recipes here. This was an accident that went right, that's all there is to it. I left the beef in the fridge marinating for longer than I usually do and hey presto.

I want to try Goat soon. The meat was the usual stew meat which isn't ideal for me really. I'd choose a good steak with little marbling on it to be honest but it's what I had. I also saved a failure Lamb dish by adding that meat to it which is why its loaded with good eats.  ;D

It's the doggies danglers for sure to my thinking anyway and the best red meat I've cooked.
Thanks again.

Quote from: Bobby Bhuna on December 23, 2009, 06:23 PM
I was a bit sceptical when I seen that you were using beef but that looks delicious. I'd be all over that!

I find this very interesting Frank.

Almost to the point and I noticed another member (curry god) asking whether to leave a curry in the pan for an hour, many, many others too regarding letting it stand and heating it the next day only leads me one place, the base is really important for many reasons.

I'm going to work on this a lot from this point onwards because it cannot be an accident that a CHICKEN Vindaloo/Madras and a LAMB Vindaloo/Madras are inseparable in taste but for the meat.

I'll get back on the above but I will give your base a try with one modification. I'll caramelise onions, then add spices to that, then add water + Cardamoms/Hard Spices.

Not humble in the slightest. It's a road isn't it and it gets people nearer where they want to be. Thanks for posting this, I truly love cardamom when its a hint. Nice one thank you.  ;D

Quote from: Frank1 on December 21, 2009, 11:47 AM
No, not a pro base, my amateur, humble attempt.. Yes a very mild base with just a hint of chilli. The warmth comes from the other spices.
I used white onions but as you say, red onions might be a good variation.
Take care with the black cardamoms or the whole dish will take on a smokey, almost burnt flavour.

Frank

Done. Sorry I forgot about that.  :
Thanks CA.

Quote from: Cory Ander on December 23, 2009, 03:06 PM
Hey Mikka, why don't you provide a link to your recipe here (and vice versa)?

Ok, ok this is a family cooking show.  ;D

Quote from: Cory Ander on December 23, 2009, 03:04 PM
Into the MEAT! 

That would be a sharp knife into the meat mate.  ;D

Quote from: Cory Ander on December 23, 2009, 02:55 PM
Haha, and there's me thinking I was telling you where to stick it! 

Oddly I was talking to Cory about this a few weeks ago. I always use measuring spoons. I'm not strict on perfect measures since I constantly taste and adjust but I find them very useful.

That said I use Desert spoons too.  :

Quote from: Bobby Bhuna on December 23, 2009, 02:39 PM
Is anyone currently using measuring spoons? I think it would be a good way to standardise our units.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Cheers

BB.

Resizing and telling me where to post it.
Actually that sounds quite rude doesn't it Lol! ;D

Quote from: Cory Ander on December 23, 2009, 02:49 PM
And what's the second account Mikka? 

Many thanks Cory on two counts.
Took ages writing this up  :

Quote from: Cory Ander on December 23, 2009, 01:08 PM
Resized to 700 pixels wide.

Looks very nice Mikka! 

I was asked post my recipe and method for this.
Image in "Pictures of your Curries'
https://curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4087.msg37089;topicseen#msg37089


At first look its doesn't look anything like BIR but I've made both beef and Lamb exactly the same way with excellent results just about every time. Please see sources at the foot of this message for details on where and how I put it together? Thanks.

DS = Desert Spoons
Garlic Pulp I create on a surform tool used for grating cheeses.

Marinade:
1 DS Tamarind concentrated paste.
1/4 Cup Fresh Garlic pulp
1 DS Oil (Can use Spice oil).
1 TBS Grated Ginger. (Use the 2nd smallest area on a cheese grater - These should be thin strands).
1/2 Cup Yogurt

These spices:
1 TSP Cumin
2 TSP Garam Masala
1 TSP Turmeric
1 TSP Chilli Powder
1 TSP Sea Salt
2 x Green Chillies Very finely Chopped

Marinade Method:
Mix everything together leaving yogurt until last. Add yogurt but make sure the whole mix is evenly distributed with spices/oils and garlic.

Meat: 1 Pound LEAN LARGE cubes, Make certain the cubes are no smaller than 1 1/2 inch.
Get a sharp knife and stab each piece. Also use a metal meat pounder but don't be too harsh on each piece. (BEEF ONLY).

** Do not use meat tenderizer powder it will ruin your meal/Papaya ok. **
** USE YOUR HANDS TO PRESS MARINADE INTO MEAT!! **
** Combine marinade with beef or Lamb and refrigerate for 48 hours **

IF USING LAMB?
Same as above but there is no need to pound the meat.

======================================================================

PRECOOKING: (1) (SEARING) AFTER 48 HOURS..............

Method:
1. Get your favourite pan on the fire on medium heat.
2. Add the oil of your choice.
3. Add each piece of meat to your pan carefully so piece do not touch each other.
4. Check each side of the meat. We are searing and sealing juices in.
5. Turn each piece and cook until all sides are dark brown. Don't worry if you carbonate edges it only adds flavour.
6. Once you are certain all sides are evenly cooked through remove and store in an airtight container with the lid half off to to allow steam to escape. Cover when room temperature and refrigerate.

** Remember if you don't seal your meat you'll lose flavour and juices nessecary to cook it. Not the point of spending hours doing this so just make sure yeah.

======================================================================


PRECOOKING: (2) Finalizing the Beef or Lamb:

1. De glaze the pan with 3 TBS white wine. I used Blue Nun.

Like it or not both take ages to cook and get mellow and soft, beef takes even longer so be prepared to sit it out, the journey is well worth it.

INGREDIENTS: (Spice Mix).

1 TSP Chilly pwdr (Or to taste).
1/4 TSP AllSpice.
1 TSP Ground Cumin.
1 TSP Ground Coriander.
1/4 TSP Ground Green Cardamom.
1 TSP Paprika. (I used normal variety).
1 TBS Ground Fenugreek leaves (Use a pestle and mortar on this).
1/2 TSP Kocher Salt.
1/2 TSP Suger (White)
1 TSP Turmeric Pwdr
1 TSP Tamarind concentrate
* Mix the Above very well please.

Other additions:
1 Desert spoon Garlic chopped fine.
2 TSP tomato paste mixed with water.
1/4 TSP Ginger paste grated into fine lengths. (See above).
2 TBS FINELY chopped green pepper.
Dash of hot sauce. (Chilli sauce - See video for brand I used).
350 mls or to taste and texture base sauce. (I used Bruces).
4 to 6 TBS oil (Any).
2 TBS 'DEEP' Brand HOT Mango Chutney (Mash this with a fork).
Base sauce: I had a small pot (1 litre) on the go in case it started drying out on me?

METHOD:
Overview:

We start like any curry, we add oils, spices, base sauce but we do so on a much lower heat and for a longer time. The spice mix above will make just enough for two curries so if you want to halve up your meat and make something different it should be very easy.

!! The Spice mix above will not counteract its contents and become overpowering at all. I've cooked this for 3 hours and more with nothing but extra taste.

OK LET'S START! (Base sauce on heat please and ready).

1. Get your curry pan on medium HIGH heat at the start.
2. Add Garlic - cook 30 seconds.
3. Add Ginger - cook 30 seconds.
4. Add green Chillies - cook 15 seconds.
5. Add the spice mix. - cook 15 seconds.
6. Add the Mango Chutney - cook but lower heat.
7. Add Green Pepper.
8. Add one ladle of base sauce and mix thoroughly.

** Notes: Most of us know what this part is about. See other recipes too for general practices.

9. Add meat and make sure it gets completely coated in sauce and spices.
** Add more base and LOWER heat to lowest setting.... !!!
10. Add some hot sauce, (Chilli/Garlic sauce) towards the end and mix it in. Just a few drops.

=========================================================================

LOW AND SLOW:
Here you can relax a bit, go get a beer watch TV but please check that nothing dries out making sure you turn the meat regularly.

WHAT HAVE WE HERE?
Well your base has just turned into a curry like it normally does only we have a slow clock on it.

WHEN IS IT READY?
When it is really. You can speed it up if you like but sauces will evaporate leaving your meat high and dry -  slow is best.

*** When done a fork should pass easily through the meat.

=========================================================================


NOTES:
You can add water if needs be but not too much and it must be warm. Wine is a good option too but make it a fruity wine but again not too much, just a splash.

HOT Mango Chutney livens things up and marries well with the rest of the ingredients. Remember to add some of the chilli oil in the jar too.


========================================================================
///// If you have gotten this far then you're a hero. Your food will be great. /////
========================================================================

SOURCES:


Yogi Gupta: An excellent resource for any avid Indian Cook!!!
http://www.indiacurry.com/lamb/l008lambvindallo.htm
A video I cannot find which showed the spices that I now use in marination. Wonderful taste truly.