Topic: Curryheads "Madras 2011"

[peterandjen]

Nice one

[solarsplace]

Nice one

Welcome aboard!

The more like minded "curryheads" that get involved - the better

[PaulP]

Having made this base many times I would say 450 ml is about the best quantity of oil to use. Mick revised the 400 ml upto 450 ml after cooking it several times and I have to agree. You can go up to 500 ml but that's pushing it a bit.

Paul

[976bar]

Hi Paul,

Interesting post, and a subject that we really need to understand a bit better.

I've no idea what temps spices cook at but I would suggest, not very high for not very long.  It's so easy to burn spices.  The reduction method virtually takes all the risk away, great for newbies to BIR cooking.

I also think how we heat spices makes a difference too!  Simply boiling them doesn't work (unless they're whole spices of course) the ground spices tend not to dissolve and leave a gritty texture.  However, boiling them in a base sauce that contains about 3 tbsp of oil per 300ml of base, as the Taz base does, works fine.

Anyway, are we settled on the Taz Base, Taz Mix, and TAZ method, for the first test?   All's we need now, is a Madras to try this with!

Perhaps Achmal/Mick would like to suggest a Madras recipe that he may have tried using the Taz combo?

Ray

P.S,  Just a quick thought.  I struggled to blend down the coriander and cumin seeds with this base, and often picked up a bit of husk in the final dish.  I spoke with Mick, and he confirmed that he now uses ground spices.  So, Are we all going to do the same?  The options being;

a) We use the whole spices as the spec recipe
b) We measure out the whole spices as the spec recipe, roast, then grind to powder
c) We measure out the whole spices as the spec recipe and gind without roasting
d) We just use packet, ground spices

My problem with d) is, will 1 tbs of whole coriander produce 1 tbs of gound coriander?  Until we know what equates from turning whole spoces in to ground spices, we may not add the correct amounts.

Ray

Hi Razor,

I've been giving this a bit of thought too and come up with this idea. I have a blender which I use for smoothing out base sauce, doing smoothies, etc etc etc, I also have a grinder which I use for grinding whole spices down to a powder. I also have a small grinder/blender which I use for making my garlic and ginger puree and for small quantities of pastes that require a little liquid.

This weekend, I am going to make Taz's base sauce, and use whole spices which I will put into my spice ball which will hold them all in one place and then toss this into the base whilst cooking.

At the end, I will empty the contents of the spice ball, i.e. the coriander and cumin seeds into the small blender with a little of the base sauce and blend until completely smooth. I know this blender will achieve that

I'll then add the contents into the large blender with the remainder of the base sauce to produce a really smooth base without any husks or rough bits.

If we consider the type of blender used in a restaurant which is like a road Kango with a large generator on it , capable of digging up half the M6 in 24 hours, it will have the power to disperse these husks and give a really smooth base.

Anyways, I'll give it a go at the weekend and post the results with some pictures....

Incidently, it would be a good idea if more people on here posted their results with pictures, rather than just comments....... Chin Chin!!

[Peripatetic Phil]

Update on grinding cumin from seed.

No loss in volume, as far as I can ascertain : one teaspoon cumin seeds yielded one teaspoon ground cumin.  No significant difference in overall flavour or aroma of curry.

** Phil.

[Razor]

Hi Phil,

I suspected as much, as cumin seed can almost be crammed in, with little air between each seed unlike coriander.

Good effort that man ;D

Ray

[joshallen2k]

Reading this thread, I made the Taz base again, and again adapted the Dopiaza recipe to a standard Madras. Once again it was an excellent curry and reinforced that probably its the best I've made. I did add a splash of Worcs sauce per the Jeera recipe just for a go.

I do wonder though about the fact that the method is a reduction-spice-fry, and how that might skew the goal of the "Madras 2011" exercise.

On the whole spices question, I've been using whole spices and using a blender to puree, instead of a hand blender.  Three or four minutes per batch completely purees the coriander/cumin. I've burnt out several hand blenders trying to puree whole spices.

And yes, the coriander grinds down to about half or less of the equal whole volume cumin, so I think substituting ground spices for whole is not a great idea unless someone figures out a proper conversion quantity.

-- Josh

[Curry Barking Mad]

Hi SP,

I'm fine to go with the recipe as spec first off.  I will give it a wizz with my hand blender this time.

So, for the Madras, do we need to pick ten of the "most popular" and set up a poll?  or, should we wait for Achmal to offer a suggestion, afterall, it is his/Taz's base?

Ray

Hi All,
I have come up with a madras recipe that I feel would fit the base, I've concluded the amounts are similar to what I have seen Taz use although chefs don't measure out, as you know.

450 ml of warm base,
1 tablespoon of chopped garlic,
2 tablespoons of tomato paste (slightly watered down),
1 tablespoon of Mix Powder,
.25 teaspoon of salt,
1.5 teaspoons of chilli powder (deggi mirth)
1 teaspoon of methi,
Precooked meat of your choice,
2 tablespoons of chopped coriander,
1 teaspoon of lemon dressing or juice.

Add 200 ml of warm base to the pan or wok,
Add the garlic, tomato paste, mix powder, salt, chilli powder, methi,
Over a medium to high heat reduce down until there is very little water left and the oil has come through, stirring occasionally, make sure you scrape down the brown caramelising residue on the side of the pan back into the mix,
This is the awkward part to explain, the mix should be quite thick. If you add the remaining base when the first reduction hasn't gone far enough then the flavour won't have developed enough and the curry can be bland.
Add your precooked meat,the coriander and the lemon dressing,
Add the remainder of the base and reduce to your desired consistency.
If the method has been correct then you will have a rich, full flavoured curry.

I hope that explains it,
Regards,
Mick

[Razor]

Hi Mick,

Many thanks.

So, Are we all happy to proceed?  If so, I think we need to establish the the 'rules' (horrible word)

Can I offer my interpretation?

1)  We do the base recipe as spec with the exception of the oil, and go with Achmals suggestion of using 450ml of oil.

2) We follow the reduction method, however tempting it may be to do otherwise ;D

3) We go with Mick's suggested Madras recipe for the first attempt.

Ray

[solarsplace]

Hi Mick

Is the Methi in powdered or leaf form please?

Hi Ray

In agreement.

Cheers All.

Oh, BTW, did a side by side comparison using Taz base, mix and Zeera Madras (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=5376.0).

One used the fry, one the reduce, I have to say in all honesty the only differences were that the fry released a greater aroma during the cook, the reduce was far more relaxing and less stressful to cook. The finished products were almost impossible to tell apart.

The wife who was not present and therefore not affected by the cooking process at the time could not really tell a difference.

I will say though, that I need to find a new favourite TA, because this combination absolutely shat on their Madras without a second thought!