Topic: the real base sauce taught by Indian chef

[haldi]

I was keen to try the base because of the odd tarka recipe.
I've never come across this "pouring the oil onto the spices in the base" bit.
I made the Korma because I wanted a recipe that was suited to this base.
Has anyone else had a go?
I think I might be the only one
I want to know what others think
Perhaps, the apparent lack of popularity for this base, may be because not many people want to make a korma

[ronnoc]

I was keen to try the base because of the odd tarka recipe.
I've never come across this "pouring the oil onto the spices in the base" bit.
I made the Korma because I wanted a recipe that was suited to this base.
Has anyone else had a go?
I think I might be the only one
I want to know what others think
Perhaps, the apparent lack of popularity for this base, may be because not many people want to make a korma

the only reason i have even mentioned the korma was that i thought it was the simplest curry of all.
no chilli, no tomato puree. very basic spices.
it was an introduction to this base sauce which goes in all curry's. what other curry's do you make haldi. do you not put base sauce in these. if you have a base sauce which i think you think it is a little strong in garlic/ging then don't add anymore to the finished dish. as i said if you follow the KD method and change the base you should have something pretty close to the takeaways.
PLAIN CURRY
if you try this-
4 table spoons of veg oil
few small pieces of green pepper. fry on medium to high for maybe a minute and remove.
he then adds about two table spoons of tomatoe base he makes himself. i don't know exactly how he makes this but i think if you just use 1 table spoon of double cons tamatoe puree will be similar. he also adds about 1/2 tsp of garlic/ginger but leave out if your base is strong in this.
1 dessert spoon of mild madras curry powder
1/2 tsp of chilli powder
1 tsp of fenugreek leaves (dried)
pinch of salt and return to pan and fry for a further minute or so stirring all the time. remove from heat if it seems like it is gonna burn. when aroma is right add a little of curry base sauce and any meat or veg. and carry on frying. stir if needed. add more of the base sauce until you have it all in. about 3/4 pint in total of base sauce.
reduce heat and simmer for maybe 5 mins. when oil rises to top is ready. garnish with corriander and there you have plain curry.

1st question regarding speed.  i'm sure we have all seen them in action. but yes to me even when they do a korma or a masala they seem to do the frying part rarther fast and add a little of the base sauce to prevent things from sticking

[JerryM]

ronnoc,

many thanks for your efforts please keep going.

i've made the base and it's certainly very different to anything i've tasted. you certainly get a very good yield (volume) - my pans full.

i've used KD for many years and switched since joining the forum to parker21 which i class as a delux base (the key differences to KD being addition of carrot, green pepper, coconut milk & garam masala). i am having very good success with this base making CA's Chicken Tika Masala and madras curry.

i don't like celery and surprisingly had to buy from ASDA (none in stock at my Indian supermarket - either they don't keep it or it was sold out).

i like the smell of the base cooking (i think down to the celery) and was amazed that you can't taste it in the final base sauce.

although sceptical of the cabbage (you've guessed it not keen on it either) i think it made a significant improvement to the smoothness and taste.

in summary so far very impressed:
1) thumbs up celery and cabbage
2) did not miss the smaller proportion of tomatoes that i would normally use
3) would add more garam next time (personal preference or due to using made curry powder - Bruce Edwards)

i am cooking using it tonight so will post results.

[ronnoc]

many thanks for your encouragement jerry. am i right in reading that you have made the ronnoc base that i have posted?
if so i notice you mention you might add a little more garam masala next time. where haldi felt it was too strong. you do have to go very easy with it and the chef has also told me that.
i visited my takeaway last night and made my own prawn buna and lamb tikka korahi.
i also asked him again about his base sauce. we had a good talk about it. i asked him if he uses potatoe at all. he said no as he felt it would not use well the following day and not keep so well. just cabbage he said. he also spoke of other chefs putting cream coconut in their bases which backs up other claims on this site.

like you i don't care for cellery. but since getting into curry's and finding out we get our flavour partly from a variety of selected veg blew my mind. i am now really starting to enjoy veg now and try and blend a little veg into any dish i make. from bolognaise onwards e.t.c.
if you read the pots on your fav dish it will probably say veg extract.
let me know how you get on. i hope to make a curry this week and photo my results.
ronnoc

[Cory Ander]

Hi Ronnoc,

Any chance of letting us know which restaurant this recipe is from please?

Thanks 

[ronnoc]

hi cory. as much as i want to i don't want to spoil what i have. i am building a fairly good relationship with this take away but don't know how it would go down if i was found out. i am sure things might be o.k. but hope you can understand that it feels a little cheaky on my behalf.
ronnoc

[Cory Ander]

Yes, I can understand and empathise with that Ronnoc. 

Can you tell us which town it is in then (so we can get a feel for possible regional differences)?

[JerryM]

Ronnoc,

In summary I am in no doubt the ronnoc base is quality.

Going fwd I would like help on the cooking stage ie technique & spice. say by chatting with the chef (who clearly knows his stuff) on his favourite dish and how to make it.

I outline below the detail behind these thoughts.

My thoughts are very closely aligned with ronnoc?s. I am in no doubt of the quality of the ronnoc base. I also made the korma (the 1st I?ve ever had ? being totally against my up bringing in brum on balties and therefore dedicated to chilli, garlic & tomato). The korma was definitely restaurant quality. I had not used sugar in a curry before and was surprised how it lifted the korma. I used powdered almond which we thought was ok but probably not likely to be as good as creamed coconut which we use for CA?s Chicken Tika Masala. I intend to try the almond in the CTM next time to compare fully (possibly a proportion of each). Due to my level of expertise I found the cooking method difficult (adding dry powders) and would change slightly (add curry powder as paste, add almonds & condensed milk after the base).

Back to the base. I had some parker21 base so 1st made my std madras (gleaned from the various nuggets on the CRO). The method for info (the qty?s are down to preference and suit me) : frying pan on high heat, add oil (1 tbsp), add garlic/ginger paste (2 tbsp), fry until raw smell has gone (this is probably about 1 min and involves stirring and moving the pan off the heat so as not to burn), add spice paste (1 tsp LB?s spice mix, 2 tbsp tom puree, water to make runny paste) and fry until water is almost gone (see other posts termed ?toffee? smell), add ? ladle base (50 to 75ml) and fry again until water almost gone, add 3 ladle of base, add splash of worcester sauce and cook on medium heat for typ 5 mins, not essential but sometimes add some chopped coriander just before the end.

I set about repeating this using the ronnoc base. 1st go - result disappointing (nb ronnoc base is more bland than parker 21). 2nd go repeated but added garam masala (2 pinches) but result was worse (spices no longer in balance). 3rd go repeated std but increased spice mix to 3 tsp. Result was ?essentially? as good as curry made with the parker21 base.

The reason for ?essentially? is:
a) the depth of spice is better in parker21 due to the larger qty of garam masala. I think this is where ronnoc?s chefs experience must takeover at the cooking stage in that he can get the spice mix spot on for the base which I can only do through trial an error over a long period of time. I think the addition of garam masala at the base stage adds depth of spice without anyone spice overpowering at the end of the curry cooking stage.
b) I think the introduction of the celery and cabbage in the ronnoc base added depth and texture. I think the coconut in the parker21 would also benefit the ronnoc base

This leaves me thinking that once a quality base is achieved (both ronnoc and parker21 are) the difference between the bases has little impact on the final curry. It is the technique and spices at the cooking stage which now have to be targeted to achieve the next step change in our abilities.

once again, ronnoc thanks for your help and stick with us.

[ronnoc]

well jerry. thats one hell of a summary. i thought it was only me who went in to so much detail. i admire your efforts. like me you seem hungry for results. i am pleased you made my base as now you can comment. my 1st post was to inform people of this base i have been taught. it has been hard work in just instructing a Korma so obviously i intend to hold back on some things for now to save myself a massive amount of work. so far only 2 have made this base and attempted the korma. only one has been successful. this was my 1st intention. get this right and surely we are on to something here. i am sure that parker 21, marks base, the saffron base and 1 or 2 others of similar consistancy are all correct. i know that the ronnoc base is correct more than i know the others are as i have been taken through the steps not once but several times.
but i think that jerry has hit on something here which is very true of what i have seen with my own eyes. two similar results have been achieved with two differant bases. it will depend on how the chef intends to do his final stages. some i guess may like to put more of the finished result into thier base. though how will they be able to make a korma which comes back to my 1st intention.

also as haldi pointed. my base calls for a little more water. i do this after it is blended so as not to put too much in and waste it. the other thing i see which i have never seen this in my local is the oil that floats on top of the base.

i need to ammend the base with a lttle easier to follow info. i am going to embark on a curry this weekend and will also make the korma with photo's to show. please be patient with me as i have limited time. i will post these to curry king
ronnoc

[Bobby Bhuna]

Hey Ronnoc, thanks for all the images and sorry if I was a little rude before about the questions I was dubious about this recipe - with the use of Cabbage of all things but now that others are saying the base is good quality I am surprised and excited to give it a shot ;D. Most of the bases I make are very similar to each-other, so this very different recipe is going to make for a really interesting change. What I am most curious about is the texture this base will achieve.