Topic: New Base Gravy from visit to Saffron

[SnS]

Yes, I understand that SnS 

But defrosting, reblending AND reheating is the conventional wisdom to preserve the....oh hell, I'm just repeating myself.... ;D

I know what you meant CA, I was just pointing out that Ast only reheated (not reblended) it to regenerate the gravy to 90-95% original.
I'm now wondering whether it ALSO requires re-blending to get it back to 100% normal, as the "conventional wisdom" suggests. 

Regards

SnS  ;D

[ast]

The "conventional wisdom" seems to be that the curry base, once frozen, should be defrosted, re-blended and reheated, prior to reuse, to preseserve something like it's original texture and consistency.

Hi Cory.  Thanks for that.  I guess it's because I'm a newbie to all this, but I must've missed out on picking up that part of the "conventional wisdom" somewhere...   Where should I have looked that I obviously didn't to pick this up?

I don't think Ast re-blended it. Just reheated to get the oil to separate again.

That's exactly right, SnS.  Re-blending never occurred to me, and it would be a RPITA if you needed to do that every time you took the stuff out of the freezer.

Of course this would not be a problem for those who prefer to remove the oil before freezing the gravy.

Again, maybe it's just that I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm new at this, but to me, if the oil's required to make the base, then it's there for a reason and shouldn't be removed.  If it is necessary to remove copious amounts of oil from a finished base, then, again, to me, it seems like that the initial amount of oil used should be reduced.

If the proportion of oil/base is correct, then it should positively contribute to the creation of the overall curry and be "just right" in the finished dish.  The curry preparation methods (sauteeing onions/garlic, etc. and frying the spices) naturally require some sort of liquid to facilitate the proper cooking, but I found that the minimal amount SnS originally specified in his Madras interpretation of what the Saffron chef did more than adequate to provide enough oil in the finished curries I made with the fresh base.

I also don't really recall any cries of "not enough oil" prompted by the pictures of the finished curries either.  If that was the case, I would've hoped to get some constructive criticism/feedback so that my curries would improve.  I've seen similar sorts of things happening in many places on the site.

I fail to see what the overall benefit to removing the oil before freezing could possibly be.  It seems to me that it is necessary for it to be in suspension within the curry base for it to do the right thing, as any oil added during the final curry creation process would not react in the same way.

What am I missing here?

Cheers for all the replies while I was typing this.  I can't keep up with you guys! ;D

ast

[Cory Ander]

I must've missed out on picking up that part of the "conventional wisdom" somewhere...   Where should I have looked that I obviously didn't to pick this up?

Oh, it is cunningly hidden amongst all the multitude of threads AST!  I'm not surprised that you missed it! 

That's exactly right, SnS.  Re-blending never occurred to me, and it would be a RPITA if you needed to do that every time you took the stuff out of the freezer.

Perhaps AST; I do as you did and simply reheat it 

Again, maybe it's just that I don't know what I'm talking about because I'm new at this, but to me, if the oil's required to make the base, then it's there for a reason and shouldn't be removed.  If it is necessary to remove copious amounts of oil from a finished base, then, again, to me, it seems like that the initial amount of oil used should be reduced.

Seems logical to me AST.  I think SnS's statement was a little tongue in cheek though? 

I also don't really recall any cries of "not enough oil" prompted by the pictures of the finished curries either.

To my mind, most pictures depict curries that are too dry and insufficiently oily (compared to a typical BIR curry that is)

I've seen similar sorts of things happening in many places on the site.

What do you mean AST? 

I fail to see what the overall benefit to removing the oil before freezing could possibly be

I personally leave it in, but others use it to make the main dish.  I find it releases in the final dish anyway.  It no doubt adds spiciness to the main dish, but I find that it also adds oiliness.  It will also be an inferior cooking oil in that the smoke point will be significantly reduced.

What am I missing here?

Nothing mate!  Just a little patience and knowledge it seems! Stick with it! 

[ast]

That's exactly right, SnS.  Re-blending never occurred to me, and it would be a RPITA if you needed to do that every time you took the stuff out of the freezer.

Perhaps AST; I do as you did and simply reheat it 

Just to be clear, do you re-boil/re-simmer for a period of time, or do you just "warm" it?  (Genuinely curious, not trying to antagonize...)

I said 90-95% because without a side-by-side comparison of look/taste/smell/finished curries with fresh vs. re-boiled, I won't be able to say for sure.  I figured it was a safe guess based on what I remembered.

I also don't really recall any cries of "not enough oil" prompted by the pictures of the finished curries either.

To my mind, most pictures depict curries that are too dry and insufficiently oily (compared to a typical BIR curry that is)

Interesting.  My results seem pretty close to what I remember to getting in restaurants, and the resulting oily plates look about right too.  I intend to somehow start doing side-by-side comparisons from some different places to verify it, though.  The last takeaway dish I got (that Lamb Lal Maas) certainly wasn't overly oily or "wet", but maybe that was a function of what it was.

I've seen similar sorts of things happening in many places on the site.

What do you mean AST? 

I guess that came out wrong.  What I meant was encouraging, but constructive, feedback to things people have posted.  I think that's the essential benefit of having a forum.  I meant it as a good thing, CA!

What am I missing here?

Nothing mate!  Just a little patience and knowledge it seems! Stick with it! 

Sorry if it sounded like I wasn't being patient enough.  Again, that wasn't the intent.  As far as sticking with it, no danger of that not happening.  I'm hooked on this "curries at home" business!

[ast]

Results of Madras Test with Vindaloo Recipe:

Wanted to post this as I finished off my wife's mild madras from last night for lunch today.  Everything was done as per recipe except I used 1/4 tsp of the extra hot chilli powder and none of the chopped, green chillies.  You'll probably want 1/2 tsp for a "real" madras, but there was a slightly noticeable trace of heat.  It was plenty spicy for my wife, however.

I used 3 tbsp of oil since I wasn't sure how well my boiling experiment would work to ensure that there was enough oil to mix the spices and create the proper amount in the finished curry.  Here's what it looked like after it came out of the fridge:

Left-over Madras following AST Vindaloo Recipe

Cory's earlier comments about "not enough oil" and end curries being "too dry looking" got me wondering.  Here's a 1:1 zoom of the original image where it's in focus showing the consistency of both the resulting curry and giving an indication of the amount of oil.  Opinions?

Detail of Madras Texture and Oil

With exception of the few that I made with the frozen base without boiling, this is pretty consistent with how they look in the container.  Once they're presented in the plate, the oil's not quite so obvious for some reason.

I also attempted to make a Jalfrezi following the same basic recipe, but added about 1/5-1/4 green pepper, sliced into strips, then halved and 1/2 of a tomato, cut into 4 pieces, 3 tsp of tomato puree instead of 2 (figuring it was supposed to be more tomato-y) and sliced two of the green chillies length-wise.  I used 3/4 tsp of extra hot chilli powder.

What I wasn't sure about was adding lemon juice.  It wasn't for me, so I didn't taste as I went all that much.  One of the recipes on this site said "yea" and the other said "nay", so I didn't put it in, however I felt that it was missing something.  From your experience, is this the only thing I would've left out?

Oh... you'll have to forgive the large chunks of garlic in the above.  I had to have my wife chop some while I was making curries, and she doesn't chop quite as finely as I do.

If I can just fix the missing jalfrezi ingredient, that makes at least a madras/vindaloo and jalfrezi recipes to go with the Saffron base.  I also adapted the KD peas & mushrooms veggie side as well, but I need to revise the quantities for the amount of base somewhat.  I'll post it when I next make it as it turned out pretty tasty too.

Anyone else adapted any other curries to this base?

ast

[Cory Ander]

Nice effort and pics, as always AST 

Yes, plenty of oil there, for sure. 

If anything, I'd say the sauce looks a bit thick and stodgey...maybe it's been cooked too long and has congealed?

Sorry if you may construe my comments as being negative, in any way, but they are not meant to be, it's my honest opinion.

To my mind, the sauce should be nicely flocculated and not congealed.

By the way, my comments were general comments and not necessarily directed at your pics....but then again they may have been...but please don't take them too personally ok! 

[Cory Ander]

do you re-boil/re-simmer for a period of time, or do you just "warm" it?  (Genuinely curious, not trying to antagonize...)

Yes, I understand that you are not trying to antagonise AST 

I just bring the curry base to a simmer.  A big part of MY reasoning (other than the textural thing) is to minimise temperature changes upon its addition to the main curry.

[curryqueen]

Curry Base recipe copied to recipe section, by Haldi, here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2358.msg20418.html#msg20418

Patia recipe moved to recipe section, by CA, here:  http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2405.0.html

[adriandavidb]

Hi CurryQueen

Is the 'garlic/ginger' puree you use home made or bought?  If bought I presume you mean a puree already containing both, not separate garlic puree and ginger puree.  Is it the sort of stuff made by Barts or Kohinoor?

How much of the base do you put in your Patia?

regards

[adriandavidb]

Please ignore the part of the question that asks 'how much base'!  I'm not the most careful of readers!