Topic: "the largest defeat for a sitting government in history"

[Peripatetic Phil]

So what do fellow CR0 members think about this historic event ?

[livo]

I'm not a constituent but this matter will end up affecting us all somehow.  A resounding defeat. The question it raises Phil, is; What now?

[Peripatetic Phil]

I sincerely hope "a second referendum".  One with a mandatory majority required before the status quo can be changed (minimum 60:40, ideally 70:30).

** Phil.

[chewytikka]

The question it raises Phil, is; What now?

Would you like fries with that madam?  ;D

Can somebody turn Radio 4  OFF please.

[Bob-A-Job]

All of my family, from my Great Grandparents (god rest them) to my parents, siblings and extended have always been taught never to talk about Religious, Political or Fiscal matters at the dinner table (My father insisted on it and has confiscated mobile phones at the table, I just have to look at my family with one and they are soon put away somewhere out of arms reach!)... and this being a forum about food, the preparation and presentation of, I am uncomfortable.

I know my personal views and I withhold them.  However....

The process before the vote by all those involved, the MP's the media, the organisations and the EU I find greedy, untrustworthy, scandalous and possibly unlawful, that is for the courts to decide.
However, the application after the vote by those same organisations I find to be the same and abhorrent.

We know almost nothing more about what WILL happen after the vote than what was claimed before the vote because nobody is being honest and unfortunately, that is Politics, Business and similarly, strictly for clairvoyants*, psychics*, tarot readers*, astrologists*, etc*

I find the whinging about whether people voted or not and whether they will or not and which way they will, etc. on a second to be futile (see *).  However, the margin of Success over Defeat was not sufficient for me to have been decisive and I would like to see defined criteria before anything similar happens in the future, that adequately defines the thresholds for Success and Defeat and the middle ground that declares it void, at which it should be re-held - then abandoned if it fails again - not just BREXIT.

My one overriding feeling is that EVERYBODY is blaming everybody else and that Democracy has been severely eroded because...

They all gave in because the job was just too hard.  "They couldn't agree on the colour of shite" - film quote.

[chewytikka]

Nope I can still here Radio 4

(I know my personal views and I withhold them.  However....)
Didnt do a very good job there then Bob

("They couldn't agree on the colour of shite" - film quote.)
Language Timothy

[livo]

Well said.  However, even though they can't decide on a colour, it doesn't change the fact that you are all apparently in it up to nose level.

[Donald Brasco]

What next? Well nobody knows for sure, but I doubt something this important is really lurching along out of control, as it has been made to appear. Probably there's an underlying plan playing out, maybe one hatched right after the referendum went "the wrong way".(who really thought Cameron intended to offer a route out of the EU?)

2 years of getting nowhere. Present a deal which will not be acceptable to either remain or leave and thereby guarantee the thing can't happen.

So., what happens next, at least a delayed Brexit and probably a 2nd referendum once enough time has passed to justify the need for one. A second vote too soon will justifiably be shouted down by the winners from last time. Kick the can far enough down the road and you can legitimately say that it seems the public opinion has changed and thus a second referendum to get "the right result" becomes a defensible option.

Is this the game Teresa May was put into bat to play?  If so, she would have to publicly denounce a second referendum right up to the point where her hand was "forced" by some event.

Just a possible scenerio!

[Peripatetic Phil]

Or as has often been observed, "Just because I'm paranod doesn't mean I'm not being persecuted" ...

More seriously, one only has to listen to almost any debate in the lower House to realise that (with a few notable exceptions such as Michael Heseltine and Anthony Wedgewood-Benn), politicans are primarily motivated by a desire to ensure that their party remains in, or gets into, power

[livo]

You could well be describing the Parliament down here Phil. Based on the same system and just as driven by personal ambition and party affiliation. Of course it's all in the national interest, until caught with a hand in the jar or pants off. Although, we do now have a couple of NSW State pollies on extended visits to secure habitation over getting a little bit too obviously greedy.

Donald Brasco, if there is an underlying plan in any of this, who would you say is calling the shots? An individual, several, the Party machine or, for the conspiracy theorists, possibly the Bilderberg group or the World Bank. This may appear to be a flippant question but in fact it isn't. If your theory is correct, the strings are being pulled from somewhere.  Either that or it really is just lurching along out of control, in which case nobody can tell where it goes from here.