Topic: Making Abdul Mohed's Madras

[natterjak]

Hi all  ,

This thread is for me to report back on my experience of cooking Abdul's Madras recipe which is posted here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=6180.msg61863#top and using his base sauce and pre-cooked chicken posted on the first page of this thread: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=5958.0

I'd like to say up front that I'm a beginner curry chef  - I don't claim any expertise at all, so any problems I had can be attributed to my own incompetence if you like.  Please don't assume Abdul's recipes are wrong, but I will take the chance to ask some questions and hopefully Abdul will comment.

So... how did it go?  Not bad, but not perfect.

The base sauce recipe was easy to follow and with the exception of omitting the paprika from the 8 spice mix (because I didn't have any) I followed the base sauce recipe exactly.  Image 1 below is the base sauce cooking in a 5litre stockpot.



Blending the base was easy enough as even after only 30 mins cooking everything seemed quite tender and well cooked.  The aroma was of mild curry and compared to other bases I've cooked before (KD1 and Ashoka) it smelled very tasty.  At the blending stage I noted that it was very thick and I believe Solarspace has made a similar comment in another thread.  Rather than water it down, I left it as is and proceeded to cook the pre-cooked chicken and Madras curry.

By the way, the taste of the base sauce once blended was of a fairly hot but otherwise bland curry.  In place of 6 chillies called for in the recipe I used 3 large green chillies and was unsure whether to leave the seeds in or not.  In the event the seeds went in - maybe that's why it was so hot.  But no matter!  I love a curry that makes you cry so it wasn't a problem.

Picture of blended base below.  That pic is of a third of the total quantity and that's a big bowl by the way.  The overall volume of the blended base was at least 4.25litres and if diluted to the consistency of an Ashoka base it would be at least 7 litres so check you have space in your freezer before you make a batch!



The pre-cooked chicken recipe was easy enough to follow but it was unclear to me when the capsicum should be added (it appears in the ingredients list but isn't mentioned in the directions).  Perhaps Abdul could clarify?  I was concerned that cooking the chicken for 15 mins followed by cooking it again in the final recipe would lead to it being dry but in fact it was ok.  I did find however that at the end of the pre-cooked chicken recipe there was still a lot of fluid in the pan.  Maybe my cheap supermarket chicken breast was giving up water as it cooked.

Now, the Madras recipe.  This was where I had some queries but with no time to check things with Abdul and a rumble in my belly I proceeded anyway.

First question, as with the pre-cooked chicken, is when the capsicum should be added.  I put it in with the garlic/ginger and onion.  Next, it was unclear to me how long the chilli powder, 8 spice, tomato puree and lemon juice should be cooked for before adding the first ladle of base sauce.  In the event this resolved itself because with only 1 TBS of oil in the pan the spices, tomato and lemon juice were so dry in the pan as soon as they were added that a ladle of base sauce was immediately required.

However this means the spices are effectively being boiled in the base sauce rather than being fried.  Doesn't seem right?  The thickness of the base sauce also meant this stage of the cook was fairly brief before more base sauce was required.

And here's my biggest confusion over this recipe.  The ingredients call for 16 pieces of pre-cooked chicken but nowhere is there a description of the size of the pieces.  So I used the weights supplied (152 to 180g) and it turns out 175g was 1.5 chicken breast portions which was actually about 10 pieces of chicken the way I had cut it.  In total the recipe asks for 1 pint of base sauce plus 1 extra ladle full and the effect was to leave me with far too much sauce and not enough meat in comparison.  Boiling the sauce down to thicken it wasn't much of an option as the base sauce is already so thick when added, so I cooked it for the required 6 minutes.

A pic below of the final dish which came out thick and creamy in texture and very very hot for a Madras (more like a vindaloo).  There was a lot of additional sauce which is not shown (I left it in the pan as it would have drowned the plate if served).  Beneath the heat there wasn't a lot of depth of spice flavour, maybe because the spices don't seem to get a chance to fry in this recipe but rather boil down in the base sauce.  This may be due to confusion over the thickness of the base or the oil content (1 TBS seems very little to start the dish with).  At no stage did I see oil coming through to the top of the dish and apart from the initial tarka stage, there didn't seem to be a lot of frying going on, but rather bubbling and boiling of an already thick base sauce.

Having said that it was a satisfying hot curry which I enjoyed eating, but I think some tweaks will be needed and would be grateful if Abdul has any suggestions. 

[natterjak]

Ok, finally I got the images in the above post working!

[PaulP]

Hi Natterjak,

I can't answer all your questions but a few things stand out for me. First thing is the amount of oil in your madras. When I cook a madras for 2 people (but quite modest portions) I use 4 tablespoons of oil, 500 ml of base (which is also oily) and 2-3 teaspoons of spice mix and about the same deggi mirch chili powder. I think you need more oil to get the spice flavours cooked and well absorbed or your dish might seem raw and powdery.

Secondly the base sauce should not be thick and it's best to add water until it seems right, which can take a bit of experience. But generally thinner is better than too thick as it gets reduced during cooking.

Hope this helps a bit.

Cheers,

Paul

[curryhell]

This was planned for tonight but will now take place tomorrow eve.  I thinned the gravy after cooking as i too thought it was a little  thick also but very flavoursome.  I will provide feedback tomorrow along with pics.  I'll probably up the oil in the tarka to ensure i have sufficient to fry the spices before adding the gravy as Paul suggests.  That doesn't look to be a bad plate of grub there mate ;D.  Practice does make perfect and you get fed along the way

[mr.mojorisin]

great post.well put together...plate of food looks good to me 

[emin-j]

Final dish looks fine,
I use around 6-7 Tbs of Oil per portion and 3/4 Tbs of Spice Mix any less Oil and you will struggle with the frying of the Spices and you will have to add Base Sauce to early or you will burn the Spices,you can spoon off any excess Oil when the Curry is finished.
Base Sauce needs to be almost Milk like in consistency as it will thicken as you go through the frying process,having a thin Base gives you the time to complete the frying of the Chicken/Meat as pre frying is usually only 1/2 - 3/4 cooked through.

[alarmist10]

Hi natterjack

Your experience with the base gravy mirrors mine exactly.....except that I did add some extra water to the base after blending it and it does produce a lot!!  I found, like you, that the base had the look and smell both while cooking and when blended of an excellent start.

Again, I had the same experience with the Madras recipe.  My finished article looked the same as your pics.  With one ladle + 1 pint, it was a dish heavy on gravy, but no matter because I like it that way!  Perhaps Abdul meant half a pint!!  I had the same trouble as you when adding the 8Spice mix etc.  There was no time to fry the spices, and as you did, I started putting in the gravy mix.  Even though I'd added water earlier I was panicked into adding yet more water simply because I was afraid the dish would burn!  This was done in such a slapdash way that I can't begin to estimate how much I used, as even when I started to add the pint I felt obliged to add even more water to stop things from sticking.

What was missing for me was not the heat - spot on for a Madras in my view - but the lack of that depth of distinctive 'spice'  flavour.  It was this that led me to conclude that I'd made a complete mess of proportions of spices as I mentioned on the main 'BIR Bandwagon' thread.  However, as both you and Hotspice pointed out, my proportions were in fact correct.  I'd have to add my suspicion to yours that the problem stems from the spices having no time to fry off in oil before base and water were added.  I'm sure Abdul will be able to set us straight on this.  Thanks for posting the photos.  We both got the same 'look'......but what's clear is that the picture alone doesn't tell the full story!  The proof of the pudding..........etc!!

That said, it was still enjoyable to eat.  I used the same base last night with Cory Ander's Bhoona recipe and got very good results (although with the same excess of gravy!).  I did add a tablespoon of 8 spice mix + an extra half tsp of chilli powder than is called for in his recipe and there was, not surprisingly, more of the spice flavour I was looking for.

Like you, I'm anxious to hear Abdul's tips and some idea of where I went wrong!!
Best
al.

 

[alarmist10]

Oops........I meant to give the credit to Hotstuff09, not Hotspice!  Apologies, Hotstuff.
al.

[emin-j]

alrmist10, It's OK to add water to a thick Base when in the pot but in the final Curry you have to be very carefull as adding water and not then cooking it out will leave a very weak flavoured Curry.I always taste the final Curry before serving as you can add a little Spice mix or a good pinch of Garam Masala to rescue a poor flavoured Curry,I was adamant that the Spices needed to be fried in Oil when starting a Curry but after making the ' Taz ' Curry using his method of adding Spice after the Base has gone in there was no noticeable difference to the finished Curry so the Jury is out on that one 

[Ramirez]

Great effort natterjack. Really interesting read. I've not tried Abdul recipes yet, except the pre-cooked chicken.

However this means the spices are effectively being boiled in the base sauce rather than being fried.  Doesn't seem right?  The thickness of the base sauce also meant this stage of the cook was fairly brief before more base sauce was required.

Doesn't the recipe call for frying the spices in the oil for 2-3 minutes (with the onions) then adding the base?

5.   Pre cooked chicken for curries (BIR style)

Ingredients

1.5kg of chicken breast cut into medium portions
Oil  2 ladle spoons
Onion  3 ladle spoons, chopped
Salt 1 tsp
Capsicum  quarter, chopped
Garlic ginger mix  1 tbsp
8 spice  2 tsp (heaps)
Tomato puree  1 tbsp
Gravy  half pint

Method

1.   In a cooking pot add oil, salt and cook for 1 to 2 minutes.
2.   Add the garlic ginger, onions and cook until golden.
3.   Then add 8 spice, tomato puree and cook for 2 to 3 minutes.
4.   Add the gravy and cook again for 2 to 3 minutes.
5.   Finally add the chicken portions, stir well and cook for 10 minutes and then simmer for 5 minutes (at this point the chicken should be dry). Check to ensure that the chicken is cooked.
6.   Take the pot off the cooker and allow it to cool down within 90 minutes.
7.   Store the chicken in the fridge (0 to 5 Celsius preferably no more than two days).
8.   If you are preparing your dish at the same time then you do not have to store or cool down.