Quote from: Curry King on May 03, 2005, 11:01 AM
Does seem a bit basic, have you tired this yet Pete??

I'll give it a go next weekend
I'll try it with no alterations first and add toms if it feels necessary

I got my curry club magazine and on the letters page there were several letters saying they couldn't achieve a satisfactory restaurant taste.
Pat responded by the post at
https://curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=259.0

Makes 500ml curry gravy

40ml veg oil
500ml water
1 teaspoon fennel seeds
8 cloves garlic
4 x 225g peeled onions
1 carrot
? green pepper
1 teaspoon salt

Put the oil and water into pan and bring to simmer
Add everything except salt
Simmer 45 minutes
Add salt and blend

To use, add by the tablespoon, to your fried *spice mixture with your precooked main ingredients.
Keep adding until you get the texture you require.


*spice mixture could be a phall

He gives a Phall Curry Mix:-

Makes about 100g
2 tablespoon corianders
? tablespoon cumin
? tablespoon turmeric
4 teaspoons extra hot chilli powder
1 tablespoon garam masala
1 tablespoon garlic powder

Add water to three teaspoons of the above spice mix, make a thick paste (Pat likes these pastes)
Heat 4 tablespoons of oil and fry the spice paste for three minutes

Quote from: merrybaker on May 02, 2005, 04:40 PM
Has anyone gone to a BIR that calls itself a "vegetarian restaurant" -- where no meat at all?is served?? Do their curries have "the flavor"?? If not, curry-jelly sure sounds like the answer.? Also, if the owner or chef is a practicing vegetarian, he might be more likely to rat on the competition that uses curry-jelly.?

I don't want to be the sole informant on this issue, but I used to go to "poppadoms" radford road, nottingham.
That used to be a vegetarian restaurant.
Although some of the curries had a gravy, they never had the taste.
Anyone else been to one?

Quote from: Mark J on May 02, 2005, 06:46 AM
Ive started adding this liquid to my base also, it smells our of this world

That sounds like a much more practical thing to do.
Do you have any whole spices in the water as well?
Making jelly by boiling for FOUR hours is just not something most people have time for.

A chef may be preparing four dishes at a time.
He won't be changing,spoons he stirs with, for each dish.
Your mushroom bhajee will have a bit of chicken balti  in, won't it?.
If anyone is really bothered, about being true vegetarian, then surely that would decide it for you.

Well if Stephen made a base in that quantity ,without it changing it's general taste, that ends the "needing to cook in large quantities to get the taste" theory.
And congratulations too!
That was a lot of curries!!

Quote from: Yellow Fingers on May 01, 2005, 06:48 PM
I use ajwain seeds but they don't really seem to add anything significant to the flavour.

Did he say if that curry gravy is then used for vegetarian dishes as well?

Quote

I wasn't that impressed with ajwain seeds either. I got loads in the packet too.
I? don't think thyme will be much different.
But because this chef is on the level,? I will try it.
He only wants to help.
And yes the curry gravy, with jelly, is used for everything.
Please bear in mind that this chef no longer working.
Perhaps practices have changed.
He stopped being in a restaurant in the nineties.
If you're having a chicken or meat curry, then non veg curry gravy doesn't matter a bit, does it?
Maybe some restaurants have two pots of curry gravy.
One with jelly and one without.
I am sure that the curry gravy I had demoed at Bengali Cuisine was missing something.
Perhaps if I had asked for a chicken rhogan josh then they would have pulled out this carton of chicken jelly.
If anyone has another demonstration then it is something to ask.
I have heard too much from too many sources, about this jelly, to dismiss it now.
They definitely make it.
If it's not for our curries, then what is it for?
I have loved curries all my adult life but I have been put off them by this.
That's the vegetarian in me speaking.
I'm going to keep to home made stuff (which is pretty good!)

Quote from: Blondie on May 01, 2005, 09:26 AM
Hi Pete,

So are you saying that the boiled chicken jelly is definately present and is a missing taste in the BIR curry ?

And do we all go along with this AND CurryQueen's assertion that it is definately in the reused oil ?

If both of these are in fact true, I for one will never be able to replicate a BIR curry because I will not be boilling up chickens and won't reusee oil.

Thanks Pete & Curry Queen,

Blondie

I have seen the oil salvaged too.
I have been told by chefs that you can't do their curries exactly the same at home.
I thought they were being "difficult"
The truth is that in practical terms, it just isn't worth it.
How many hours can you dedicate to one meal?
I won't be doing the chicken bones stock anymore.
Re using oil could be dangerous too.
So I'm stopping that.
I have found out things that I wish I hadn't.
I will see if I can find alternatives to create what I want.
But I believe unless you use these methods you can't exactly duplicate a BIR.
Believe me, I would love someone to prove me wrong.

I spoke again with the ex restaurant chef, who supplied the curry gravy recipe at
https://curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3.0
He was very pleased that my cooking was working out well at home.
When I ran through the recipe again, he said there was something missing.
He had difficulty pronouncing it and I had to bring him samples to identify.
It was thyme.
Now I wouldn't get too excited about this (although I have not tried it yet)
Because a lot of us have tried Bruce Edwards Curry House Cookery recipes.
He uses Ajwain Seeds (lovage seeds) and this has written on the pack
"aromatic ajwain seeds have a strong pungent flavour similar to thyme".
They are packed by Natco and sold in Asian shops, so I have no doubt they are used in indian cooking.
But the chef said I should be adding in 1 teaspoon of thyme (after I have ground it) along with the tomatoes.
He also confirmed the addition of chicken jelly, to the curry gravy, when it was reheated at the start of the evening.
I discussed the missing taste we have all talked of.
He replied that he told me everything, and had no idea what it could be.
I am 100% sure this is true.
When he used to cook, nearly all the flavour came from the curry gravy.
Pre cooked vegetables, chicken and lamb were all boiled in water, salt and turmeric.
Some meals were simply heated curry gravy with precooked ingredients added.
I don't suppose that all chefs have the same recipes but this is the truth from this one.

So we have from him

1 the full curry gravy recipe
2 precook instructions
3 chicken jelly recipe instructions

Everything else is down to experience.
We could always do with more "seen" recipes though.
I still want that.