rallim, i am going to try this recipe along with Cory Ander's this weekend. i also make my own bread now and again. in the past I've found the KD recipe for Naan to be pretty good - the supring element being caster sugar.

this does make a big difference in terms of sweetness compared to normal sugar.

unclebuck's recipe does not have any sugar where as KD and Cory call for 2 table spoons in 450gm and 1000gm respectively.

i am going to put 2 tbsp of caster in when i make Unclebuck's.

Ast, totally agree with your thoughts. thanks jerry

Many thank's UB very interesting post. I've settled over time on KD's but will try your's next as it looks much better and like the real thing.

i have cast iron frying pan which i use if it's raining. however i bought a gas BBQ a few years ago (they are simply brill - i leave outside my kitchin door and use all year round). The difference it makes in cooking Nans is quite a suprise compared to the cast iron pan.

I also use caster sugar which gives it a much sweeter taste than normal sugar.

One question though which i have not been able to decide on myself - do they need the egg in?

Gary,

your info is totally spot on. premier league status for sure.

have made about 6 test madras curries (about 200ml).

the 1st was using my normal method (oil in med/hot pan, then base sauce, then spice mix, then just before serve a little garam). i found your sauce to be much better than my normal KD. importantly it did not need the garam which has been a real problem in that in getting a spiced dish i could not get an even spice (something however much i change the garam ended up sticking out and spoiling the overall flavour)

the 2nd was your method (and probably closest to your instructions). the garlic did not brown but did release the rawness smell. i got the "toffee" smell which i prefer to call "choking" as to me the smell is nothing like toffee but very much a desired smell. i don't think i simmered for the 5 mins though and tasters complained that fine chopped garlic was still hard.

3rd go i got the garlic slightly brown and left the choking smell develop a little longer but again failed to let simmer enough to Cook the garlic through. this had the taste of takeaway/restaurant standard.

then i went totally wrong. i make pizza myself and pre cook the garlic to avoid it being hard. this ruined the choking smell. the curries were still good but now clearly dropped a league.

conclusions:
1) i am sold on this and the need for toffee smell as you call it.
2) the garlic must be raw and only cooked on medium heat until rawness smell gone (quite quick).
3) full heat is used to cook the water puree spice mix to get the toffee smell
4) essential to simmer for 5mins to get the garlic to cook through
5) i would not put chilli in the base as this reduces cooking stage flexibility
6) the existence of garam in the base gives good spice at cooking stage without anyone spice overpowering the rest

possible changes not really. i like garlic and i did put 1/4 bulb in the base which i think i would increase next time to a full bulb. still retaining the pinch at cooking stage. i am not sure on the absence of ginger but did not miss it. the only mix i buy is a tandoori masala which i use only for chicken either tikka or coated for use on pizza. i might just try this instead of spic mix to change from madras curry to tikka masala curry.

for info my spice mix is LB's Balti book (2 tsp paprika, 1/2 tsp chilli, 1 tsp salt, 1 1/2 tsp coriander, 1 tsp cumin).

Gary, just one question - would a finer chopped garlic be better ie from a mixer rather than by hand (not puree though as i appreciate this i think would be no good)

Gary so far so good (and i mean brill).

I've got the sauce made and I've never spent so much time tasting as i moved through the stages. i normally make KD and find your's a real deluxe base.

i think the green pepper really makes a difference. i think cooking the onions for a longish time is needed to make sure their sweet. i use coconut milk quite a lot in other cooking and amazed how it's taste disappears but clearly adds character.

i did not use turmeric as i don't like it. i did not add the ground chillie at the curry powder stage (i added 3 dried red chillies instead of the green earlier and they gave it sufficient kick). i also reduced the oil to 8 tbsp and did not thereby need to remove any later. I also picked up on one of your posts and sieved the tin of toms which i am sure improves the sweetness. i used my own garam which is based around KD. i particularly like the cooking of the garam which effectively made the base spiced but very well balanced.

i need to make your madras before i finally proclaim you a star but you're almost their. my expectations are very very high.

many many many thanks for your efforts.

thanks Ast. just for info i make my own garam based around KD. I've got to the point where I've changed cinnamon to casia bark, introduced star anise and cut the cummin to 1/2 the coriander. all giving major improvement. i suspect it's the black cardamon that's overpowering and going to cut it out on my next go.

Wormix,

I've made the KD base many times and you can't really go wrong (one of the things I really like about it).

I am sure you've got it spot on. Very thin sounds right. Don't worry in any case as the final cooking stage should be to fry it when you can adjust the frying time to get the final consistency right. It also tastes very bland and you would not expect it to produce a good curry from it.

The things I do differently are 2 tins toms (as Ast) & no turmeric (I don't like taste).

For final cooking stage suggest you have a read of  https://curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2250.0.html

I don't think the "when" matters only that frying does occur. I work off 2 cook books for the base (KD and Balti by Lynette Baxter). The end result after the final cooking stage from both in terms of sweetness is the same. the KD base (onions boiled) is quite bland and needs the final cooking stage to get the taste. The LB base (fried onions) has a lot more spice in the base and tastes almost the finished product at the base stage and hardly needs the final cooking stage.

Ast, it's a brilliant post many thanks.

what garam masala mix did you use. i am trying to get one where no one spice stands out.

i to favour the KD base (but 2 tins toms and no turmeric). i think your spot on in that the missing ingredient is the cooking technique. Just like you i use a frying pan on med/high, add a little oil when the pans hot, add the base, then a simple spice mix aimed at madras (2tsp paprika, 1/2 tsp chillie, 1 tsp salt, 1 1/2 tsp coriander, 1 tsp cumin). I stir/fry the base until the spice mix is mixed in (something like 30secs moving the pan away to control the heat). I then add a little garam, stir in and serve.

I am almost there on taste. Trouble is although I?ve tried a few garam mixes I can?t get one where no spice stands out.