Topic: Recipe refinement : an alternative approach.

[Peripatetic Phil]

Inspired by Jerry M's thread on "Recipe refinement", I started this evening on my own approach to the idea.  As explained in Jerry's thread, my idea is to start with a Chicken Curry that uses solely a good curry powder as its spicing, and then add just one ingredient at a time to try to taste for myself exactly the effect that each imparts.  This evening's curry had added Kashmiri mirch.  So, recipe, method and results (no photographs : everyone knows what a curry looks like by now !).

• 2 good-size free-range chicken breasts, each cut into 4 or 5 pieces

• A little rapeseed oil in the bottom of a wok-shaped non-stick frying pan
• 1 teaspoon of turmeric
• 1 teaspoon of Kashmiri masala (paste, Pataks)
• 1 large spoon (bigger than tablespoon, smaller than chef's spoon) of KD1 base (orange, not green)
• 1 teaspoon g/g paste (all measures are rounded).

• Gently fry the last five until the mixture is just showing signs of gassing
• Add the chicken pieces, turning and stirring until they are thoroughly coated in the mixture
• Keep gently cooking, stirring and turning for a few minutes, then put the lid on (to conserve moisture) and continue to cook until the chicken is just   firm (no more than just firm)
• Using chopsticks or whatever, remove the chicken pieces from the pan and reserve the liquor
• Add about 5 tablespoonsful of rapeseed oil to the pan
  • 3 teaspoons good quality curry powder (Rajah Hot)
  • 2 teaspoons Kashmiri mirch
  • 1 teaspoon sea salt
• Gently fry the spices until they just start to gas
• Add 1/2 tablespoon tomato puree, diluted with 1 tablespoon boiling water
• Increase the heat slightly, then stir and cook until the spices start to gas
• Add a little KD1 base (orange, not green) and stir
• Increase the heat to maximum and cook until the centre of the pan is bubbling well (keep stirring)
• Add a little more base and stir
• Keep adding the base, a little at a time, until 3/4 pint has been added (keep stirring)
• When all is at a gentle rolling boil, add the pre-cooked chicken pieces and stir well
• Reduce the heat and cook "until the oil comes out"
• Add the reserved liquor and cook for a further two minutes or so.
• Remove the chicken pieces as before into a serving dish, then pour on the sauce until the dish looks well balanced.  Serve with chappati (as I did) or pulao rice (as I would have done had I not found it covered in mould !).

Comments : a very acceptable chicken curry, fairly close to Chicken Madras in terms of heat and colour.  Would not disgrace any restaurant, and far better than many I have eaten from restaurants & takeaways.

Possible improvements that would not affect the overall simplicity : add chopped coriander stalks for the last couple of minutes, garnish with coarsely cut coriander leaf.

Verdict : absolutely fine; I may report back again when I have eaten the remaining 50%.

** Phil.

[Stephen Lindsay]

Phil I don't know if these notes that I made a while back when doing a basic medium curry will help or not but I thought you might be interested in them. I've yet to follow this up from my conclusion but I think it shows how tasty a curry can be with the minimum of ingredients.

Medium Chicken Curry

I remember some discussion in a post a while back where one member (CA I think) suggested that the best test of your curry technique is to produce a medium curry.  Stripped back to basics, with only the minimum of ingredients, the medium curry has nowhere to hide.  Making this curry depends on good technique to bring out the flavour of a limited amount of ingredients.

But how limited should this be?  I checked out a few recipes to see how to approach this curt using my current base of choice for the past year, the Taz base.  Bruce Edwards

[Peripatetic Phil]

Thank you, Stephen.  Very interesting.  Would I be right in thinking that the Taz base must have an unusually high oil content, given that (as far as I can see) there is no explicit oil in your recipe ?

One thing I forgot to add to my earlier post is that the sauce was very very moreish; exactly the sort of sauce that you cannot leave on your plate, but just have to mop up with a chappati.

** Phil.

[Stephen Lindsay]

Phil

Yeah the Taz base is oiltastic and lends itself to frying without starting with oil.

Look forward to reading the results of your efforts.

Steve

[JerryM]

Phil,

love your enthusiasm and am sure we can collectively make progress.

the immediate thoughts are that a "control" is needed and the aim is simply - closer to BIR or not (and i mean your fav top notch BIR).

further thoughts then being i like kashmiri chilli and keep it on stock. i use it sparingly as a sort of "posh" chilli (i make a chilli sauce for madras curry - secret santa's, http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4076.0).

the question from your output would then be - where do i use plain chilli and where do i use kashmiri. and of course your mind then starts running and what about deggi which i also rate and normally use for colour only.

[Peripatetic Phil]

Version 2 : replace 1 teaspoon of Kasmiri Mirch with 1 teaspoon of Bassar Curry Masala.
Verdict : No improvement, probably less satisfactory, will not be repeated.

** Phil.

[JerryM]

Phil,

much appreciate your interest and dedication.

not being negative as i know failure is often necessary for success - got me puzzled though why this particular switch as they are not the same thing or category. the kashmiri is chilli powder whilst the bassar is mix powder related.

i've found (but not exhaustive) the bassar only works in some dishes (i only use it in kashmiri and vindaloo).

are you doing a series of swaps or have you a plan that you're working through.

ps i've now got a draft list of ingredients and effect which i'm still working on - would this be of use

[Peripatetic Phil]

not being negative as i know failure is often necessary for success - got me puzzled though why this particular switch as they are not the same thing or category. the kashmiri is chilli powder whilst the bassar is mix powder related.

Basically building on past experience. My background is KD1, and one of my first improvements (after doubling all the spice quantities) was to replace some of the ground chillies in her Chicken Madras by Bassar Curry Masala.  This made a significant improvement, and so I thought I would try the same in my basic curry.  It didn't work, but that's fine : I have learned something from the experiment.

are you doing a series of swaps or have you a plan that you're working through.

I have vague plans, but they are very short term; the next variant will probably have one teaspoonful of ground cumin added (not replacing anything), but of course I cannot add too much of anything otherwise the sauce will be too thick (unless I increase the quantity of base, or water it down ...).

ps i've now got a draft list of ingredients and effect which i'm still working on - would this be of use

Yes, I would be very interested to see it !

** Phil.

[JerryM]

Phil,

KD1 my start point too.

given what you say it would be good to keep the kashmiri in ie the std recipe and add in some bassar. as with all of this it really is trial and error - it's possible a little bassar could go into the mix powder. i must admit i do like the mix powder that i'm using (ifindforu) but nothing can be ruled out at this stage for me.

water down the base is good for me. admin 1st alerted to it in his jalfrezi. i'm not a fan of cumin so will be interesting how the next dish goes. i always work on 2:1 coriander:cumin. i have not seen the chef at my local TA add individual spice but i've only seen snap shots so can't be sure.

the only other aspect that was re enforced recently was the occasional variance even in the best BIR. the curry at my local restaurant on the last visit was what i would call slightly off par. as if it had not been cooked by the chef or he was on an off night. what i'm getting at is that i'm sure i have everything to hand i'm just missing something or a few things that occur i'm sure in BIR down to the nature of the operation c/w what happens at home. i also have in mind that parker21 said he had started measuring by eye. this could well be a factor and i think i may have to ditch the measuring spoons. for example i make coffee by eye in the palm of my hand. from this i know a slight variation can make a difference.

will put the ingredient list in my original post to keep your post focused. i am on pizza at the mo but happy to join in at end of sept.

best wishes,

[Peripatetic Phil]

given what you say it would be good to keep the kashmiri in ie the std recipe and add in some bassar.

Yes, that is exactly what I did (sorry if it was not clear).  Start is 3 teaspoons hot curry powder, first derivative is 3 teaspoons hot curry powder + 2 teaspoons Kashmiri chili, second derivative is 3 teaspoons hot curry powder + 1 teaspoon Kashmiri chilli + 1 teaspoon Bassar Curry Masala.

as with all of this it really is trial and error - it's possible a little bassar could go into the mix powder. i must admit i do like the mix powder that i'm using (ifindforu) but nothing can be ruled out at this stage for me.

OK, this is the one part I am trying to avoid (the "mix powder", that is).  IMHO it introduces too many unknowns.  Even switching from Rajah Hot Madras Curry Powder to Bolsts Hot Madras Curry Powder has affected the flavour (possibly adversely; not yet sure) and I am trying to use (with the obvious exception of the curry powder, which is my starting point, and the Bassar curry masala, because I am such a fan of it) only pure spices so that I am in a better position to judge their effect.

water down the base is good for me. admin 1st alerted to it in his jalfrezi. i'm not a fan of cumin so will be interesting how the next dish goes. i always work on 2:1 coriander:cumin. i have not seen the chef at my local TA add individual spice but i've only seen snap shots so can't be sure.

And I have gone exactly the other way; whereas my early curries all had ground coriander, I now use it not at all, using methi powder in its place.  But although I used to find the flavour of cumin intrusive, I have now come to really appreciate it, and use almost as much cumin as chilli and/or curry powder in my normal curries (typical ratio 3:2)

the only other aspect that was re enforced recently was the occasional variance even in the best BIR. the curry at my local restaurant on the last visit was what i would call slightly off par. as if it had not been cooked by the chef or he was on an off night.

Yes, the nights that the commis chef is in charge are, unfortunately, only too obvious to the more discerning customer !

what i'm getting at is that i'm sure i have everything to hand i'm just missing something or a few things that occur i'm sure in BIR down to the nature of the operation c/w what happens at home. i also have in mind that parker21 said he had started measuring by eye. this could well be a factor and i think i may have to ditch the measuring spoons. for example i make coffee by eye in the palm of my hand. from this i know a slight variation can make a difference.

Yes, if you look at my pulao rice recipe you will see I give no quantities at all; for curries I still use teaspoons, but the degree of rounding is just as the mood takes me.

will put the ingredient list in my original post to keep your post focused. i am on pizza at the mo but happy to join in at end of sept.

OK, thank you for the list; as regards pizzas (pizzae ?!), are you aiming for Italian-style or Pizza Express style ?
** Phil.