Topic: What Makes a decent BIR CTM "the classics"

[JerryM]

parker21,

not tried reducing the "pataks" element down to just the tandoori paste. i've stuck to using all 3 ie tandoori, tikka and kashmiri - it works for tikka meat. i think by reducing the proportion i'm now sorted.

the coconut powder is going into the korma paste which i combine in the pan with the tandoori. i'm also adding extra coconut powder direct to the pan for a little texture.

i have the rajah as well as the TRS and will try the rajah on the next go (no 5 & 6).

ps fully agree the tikka chicken is a must. talking scoffed the lot - my good lady normally is happy to stick at 1 off curry night per week but this CTM has changed that and looking at 3 off in the week - very best wishes.

for info the "pataks" taste that is not good is what i would describe as "tarty" best guess being down to vinegar or some additive. trouble is the pataks is better in the dish than out. a distant dream would be to make the tandoori paste from scratch ie no bought jars.

[JerryM]

found myself making tikka masala (ifindforu) and tandoori masala (parker21) at the same time.

so far i'd based the tandoori masala on tikka masala but tweaked it to what i feel a CTM tasteslike. this is difficult (and probably wrong) as i don't know what a tandoori masala should taste like and of course your tasting it raw (ie without the rest of the CTM ingredients).

anyhow cut long story short. i looked a % composition of ifindforu masala and tweaked the parker21 to it. the tandoori masala i feel tastes much better as a result.

cooking 2 off CTM tonight which will confirm or otherwise

for info revised tandoori masala:

Tandoori masala (units)
pataks tandoori paste 5
pataks tikka paste 5
pataks kashmiri 2.5
yogurt 45 (was 60)
fresh coriander 30 (was 45)
lime juice 5 (was lemon dressing)
mustard oil 10 (was 5)
tandoori masala pwdr 5 (now Rajah)
mint sauce 20 (was 10)
green chilli paste 5
milk 30 new
garam masala 2.5 new


one thing on my mind is what do BIR's do. upto press i've always thought of tikka and tandoori masala as different. trouble is now i just can't see BIR's being fussed on making 2 lots of sauce that look very similar and are not a million miles away on taste either.

any thoughts appreciated.

[parker21]

hi jerry my thoughts are that they would use the same marinade just adding tandoori red to the tandoori chicken marinade and sunset yellow to the tikka so as to differentiate between the 2.  obviously they would taste similar but different because of the leg or thigh being on the bone. not sure that the colouring isn't just for US lol!

yours is similar to mine only not mint (lamb dishes)/green chilli/lime/milk/GM. i use mouchak(although i did have great results with rajvers) mix powder/a pinch of methi/salt and lemon dressing, bearing in mind that this is for the marinade.

regards
gary

[Peripatetic Phil]

upto press i've always thought of tikka and tandoori masala as different. trouble is now i just can't see BIR's being fussed on making 2 lots of sauce that look very similar and are not a million miles away on taste either.

I've never been a fan of CTM, but I do enjoy some of the other dishes that involve chicken tikka or tandoori chicken being finished off in a spicy sauce.  Two of my favourites are Tandoori Chicken Jhoul and Chicken Shagorana, both of which are significantly different from CTM.  So I suspect that some restaurants are willing to spend the time making two or more different sauces (after all, a BIR sauce is basically a last-minute assembly rather than something the chef has spent all day slaving over), but I would also tend to think that if a restaurant offers both Chicken Tikka Masala and Tandoori Chicken Masala then the sauce will be identical modulo colouring, simply because the restauranteur will know his clientele's taste and will expect the vast majority to like and expect something CTM-like.

** Phil.

[JerryM]

parker21/Phil,

what you both say is exactly the conclusion i've come to ie the marinade is the same except for coloring.

the only additional difference i can see is the addition of tandoori powder to the tandoori version which would be optional in the tikka version. i think the likelihood for most TA is to use exactly the same.

ps Phil never been fan myself of CTM but good lady and familly/friends are. with the home made version the addition of the green chilli paste peps it up just enough for me to quite like the CTM on the qt.

[JerryM]

made 3 off CTM (Nos 5, 6 & 7) in advance last night (along with the rice) so as to have effectively a Take IN when ready to eat. worked a treat.

made the 3 off identical in terms of ingredient as the 1 st off the line tasted spot on.

i'm used to cooking using the hot method and find it difficult to convince myself to slowboat for the "creamy" dishes. i have experimented on the methods in the past and thought this was opportunity to put my mind at rest. so adopted 3 off different cooking methods:

dish No 5 - dipuraja or slowboat - all ingredients in pan and heat till done
dish No 6 - hot fry all spices together then add base ie oil, chef of base, tom puree, mix powder, bunjarra, tandoori masala, korma masala all in pan and hot fry before adding rest of ingredients
dish No 7 - hot fry in sort of 3/4 stages,

a) oil, tom puree,mix powder, bunjarra, chef base
b) tandoori masala, korma masala, chef base
c) tikka meat, coconut flour, water
d) base, cream

the outcome was as expected for this "creamy" type of dish - all 3 methods produced identical result.

the tandoori masala and korma masala are unchanged from the previous post. i used 1 chef spoon or 4 tbsp in each portion (which i believe is the same amount used in the previous dishes just a little more milk added to the korma to ease handling). the rajah tandoori powder (or TRS etc) worked better than the pink leena brand which is softer in taste.

i'm now sorted on this.

will do external link to pics

[Malc.]

what you both say is exactly the conclusion i've come to ie the marinade is the same except for coloring.

I have no doubt that some outlets may well do this, but i'm not convinced this is a standard practice. Comparison of Tikka to Tandoori from my experiences not only show a different colour but finish and taste as well. Tandoori always appears to have had a thicker marinade that is hotter and deeper in taste than Tikka. Since they are making two marinades, it provides the perfect opportunity to vary them. Just a thought.

I only recently learnt that the restaurants use a Chef's Masala sauce. I am now even more convinced that the CTM sauce is just a korma with this Chef's Masala added to it. The IG doesn't use a Korma Masala though, they add coconut etc, straight to the pan, then ladle in the base and finally cream or condensed milk. I don't know if bunjarra would be added to a CTM, but it certainly sounds like a tasty thing to do.

Sterling efforts Jerry.

[Peripatetic Phil]

parker21/Phil,

what you both say is exactly the conclusion i've come to ie the marinade is the same except for coloring.

Ah, sorry, I didn't make myself clear.  I don't actually believe that the two marinades are the same; rather, than the two sauces are the same for Chicken Tikka Masala and Tandoori Chicken Masala.  My belief is that the marinades for Chicken Tikka and Tandoori Chicken are different, and that the Tandoori Chicken marinade is also used for Lamb Tikka.  I would not like to guess which marinade is used for Tandoori King Prawn , but I suspect it is more likely to be the Chicken Tikka marinade than the Tandoori Chicken.

** Phil.

[JerryM]

Axe,

appreciate the extra insight. your chef's masala is what i'm calling tandoori masala.

on the coconut/almond straight in the pan i've seen this in the maliks video and i think most TA must do same down to the texture of the dish. the parker21 method of making the korma sauce (made in advance ~24hrs) took me by surprise on how well it works. in the recipe i added back some direct addition to give a touch of texture.

Phil,

no probs either way. it's that "additional" difference of adding in the tandoori powder that i was uncertain on but now see that it's a must have.

[JerryM]

chewytikka's masala (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=6005.msg59904#msg59904) reminded me that i've been tweaking this recipe. it's still work in progress but not bad.

have combined the korma and tandoori masala into one red masala as i don't need them separate for the dishes i make.

have added in veg ghee and tamarind following chriswg recommendation and switched cream for yogurt following Axe suggestion.

i use 1 chef (4 tbsp) in CTM. i still have intend to try out tgad's version (the pataks originally put me off) and perhaps do a combination to complete the journey (the info is in the 1st post ie tgads)(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3672.0)

red masala (units, read as millilitre)

pasco tandoori paste 7.5 (was 5)
pasco tikka paste 5
pataks kashmiri 2.5
yogurt 60 (was 45)
fresh coriander 30
lime juice 5
mustard oil 10
tandoori masala pwdr 5
mint 20 (now using dried mint)
green chilli paste 15 (was 5)
garam masala 2.5
ground almonds 15 (was 60)
coconut flour 15 (was 60)
caster sugar 5
veg ghee 15
salt 2.5
tamarind 5

ideally needs 24 hrs before use