Topic: A lesson in my local take-away

[jb]

I can't wait to find out how they make these pastes.

Thanks again for these very interesting posts. Here's my guess as to the ingredients in those pastes: Compared to some other recipes and sources, his CTM strikes me as glaring in its apparent omission of sugar, coconut and possibly ground almonds. When I watched the East End web cam last night they seemed to start with three pale powders for what I assumed to be CTM. East End then added a red-ish paste or masala. We know how to make Tandoori Masala from various sources.

My guess is that your take-away probably add the dry powders into the more liquid tandoori masala. This would thicken it up, so it could be 'cut with a knife'. It would be faster for them to produce a dish if the pre-mix is done in advance. On the other hand, perhaps 1 chef spoon doesn't seem enough overall quantity so I might be wrong.

Korma might be similar, with a different mix.

Although I didn't see him take a spoonful of coconut(or almonds,sugar etc) I'm sure I could smell coconut in the finished dish.When I asked the Manager about the paste I said oh I suppose coconut,sugar and he nodded.I may be wrong but I guess they've found a way of incorporating all  the necessary ingredients into 1 paste.On a Friday or Saturday night the place is manic,and I suppose anything to quicken cooking times is welcome.

He showed me the pan they cook the gravy in at the weekend...it was huge!!! When I went into the storeroom there were sacks of onions everywhere.I really can't give any more info on the chicken stock,he didn't elaborate on quantities or exactly what goes in-I'll try to find out more when I revisit.On the subject of pastes,along with the chili sauce he used for the madras he had a tub of what he called balti sauce.Again can't be sure at the moment what was in it although he did say they used Patak's balti paste but tweak it and add their own spices.

I didn't bother cooking rice as I feel I can cook pillau rice as good(or better)than some takeaways.He did precook all his pillau rice(it was in a big plastic bowl).Whenever an order came in he just put a portion into a tray and microwaved it!!!  Thought this was a bit of a cheat to be honest but he did give me a portion to takeaway and it was very nice.Keema rice was cooked in a wok with the same rice and a dollop of keema mince from another dish.I asked him how he spiced his pillau rice and it was the usual stuff..cloves,cinnamon stick,cardamom,bay,salt and fennel seeds.He used very little colour and cooked the spices in ghee.He also used a little ginger/garlic paste which I don't normally do but I'll give that a go next time.

[moonster]

JM,

you are right mate, it would be prudent of me to wait and see, if and what JB comes back with regards to the chicken bones before trying them in Razors base. I would be purely guessing if i was to try it now.

heres hoping JB can add anything further regarding this in weeks to come.

thanks

Alan ;D

[George]

He did precook all his pillau rice(it was in a big plastic bowl).Whenever an order came in he just put a portion into a tray and microwaved it!!!  Thought this was a bit of a cheat to be honest but he did give me a portion to takeaway and it was very nice.

This fits with what I heard from the most recent BIR I went to. We didn't order any pilau rice because the naan and other stuff was sufficient to soak up the sauce. At the time of ordering, I asked if we could order pilau rice later if we found we needed it. The waiter said it was no problem and could always be delivered quickly because it's simply re-heated, or words to that effect. Thinking about it, nothing else would make as much sense, if you're running a busy BIR.

[Peripatetic Phil]

you are right mate, it would be prudent of me to wait and see, if and what JB comes back with regards to the chicken bones before trying them in Razors base. I would be purely guessing if i was to try it now.

On the subject of bones, last night's curry here was made using a combined rabbit/chicken stock (with an excellent flavour all by itself).  I sauteed 1 1/2 large onions, half a carrot, half a dozen cloves of garlic, added the stock and cooked in a pressure cooker whilst I went out to buy some ginger.  When I got back the stage-1 sauce was ready, so I added some very thinly sliced ginger and pureed everything.  That then went back on the stove with one teaspoon turmeric, one teaspoon paprika, a decent squeeze of tomato puree (about 40g, looking at how much is left in the tube), all the oil left over from the previous curry plus some new grapeseed oil, and the whole then simmered for about 20 minutes.  Diluted it a little with boiling water, added the pre-cooked chicken, Bassar curry masala and salt (2 teaspoons and 1 teaspoon respectively), cooked for about eight minutes, added one teaspoon cumin, 1/2 teaspoon fenugreek and 1/4 teaspoon coriander, cooked for a few more minutes and served.  Very very pleasant but a tad under-spiced (I had held back on the Bassar curry masala because the recycled oil was very hot, but that meant that I also had to hold back on the cumin, etc., so in the end it was slightly less spicy than I would have preferred).  My wife commented that it would benefit from a little garam masala, which I tried, but I wasn't convinced it added anything other than body and a sense of "warmness" on the palate.  What remains of the sauce will be re-used to cook a second curry with fresh chicken and extra spices.

** Phil.

[Secret Santa]

When I asked the Manager about the paste I said oh I suppose coconut,sugar and he nodded.I may be wrong but I guess they've found a way of incorporating all  the necessary ingredients into 1 paste.

I wouldn't get overly excited about this paste method, it's been covered on this forum a few times.

It is, just as George suggested, the usual ingredients for a korma or tandoori masala with the extra sugar, coconut and nuts combined with it.

I think it was the post about the three-pot method where these pastes were first mentioned? I can't find it now.

Then there were the recent posts from the Aussie guy (sorry forgot your nick) and he posted similar pastes.

It's just a different technique towards achieving the same ends and doesn't really add anything to the final result.

That's not to say jb that I am not interested in this take away's own pastes. Please do post if you find out. Not withstanding my previous comments, I'm as interested as the next person.

Oh and I'd be really grateful if you could get the recipe for that keema mince. It's one of the things that I feel has not been covered enough on this forum.

[Secret Santa]

The potatoes were cooked exactly like the ones from my takeaway-texture was spot on without being mashed on the surface(unlike the technique I'm used to doing).

Actually the "mashed surface" variety is the type that I prefer. What is it in your technique that achieves this?

And those bomby potatoes in the pic look bloody delicious!

[timeless]

Thanks jb great read!

[Derek Dansak]

I have tried chicken stock many times, and its not straight forward. Basically you get a lot of red oil, and a rich chicken stock taste if you simply boil the chicken and add the stock. The taste is nice but far to strong to compare to bir cooking. The chef at my local said he uses chicken stock . however he dried up quickly when i asked him how. he said they add some to the base from pre cooking chicken. he did not explain how. I suspect its a key secret. Its not as simple as just adding a carcus, i have tried and its just not bir taste. its a lot more subtle than this. Part of the by product of pre cooking chicken is a stock that is added to the base.  However i am confident this is made with considerable skill. If possible quiz this chef on the whole process. starting with pre cooking the chicken, and then the way they arrive at the stock. Basically we need a real bir method to make decent chicken stock.  I have tried the obvious ideas of adding a carcus, or adding a ladel of stock from boiling a chicken, and its just not bir taste. If the chef can help us with this one thing (making a good chicken stock) i believe we will all benifit hugely.

[George]

Part of the by product of pre cooking chicken is a stock that is added to the base.  However i am confident this is made with considerable skill.

I agree it makes sense they could add a by-product of pre-cooked chicken (the liquid. or resultant stock) to the base sauce, even if it would shock most vegetarians. Are vegetarians protected under the law? I guess not unless a BIR declares that a vegetable dish is produced under strict vegetarian conditions.

I disagree that any of this requires more than a pinch of skill, provided you have the recipe, of course. The optimal flavour will no doubt depend on the balance between the relative additions of chicken stock and plain water to the base sauce. A good chef would monitor it via tasting and we'll need to figure out how to do the same, i.e. to determine how much chicken stock to add, which will also depend on how concentrated it is.

[peteleton]

On another site ( i shall not mention the name) many moons ago when it was free they had many base sauces which included stock cubes knorr springs to mind as part of the ingredients. If i remember it was 2 cubes per 2 litres worth of base. And JB your a star. I was very close to getting into a kitchen like yourself but they backed off very quickly and withdrew the offer. So perhaps you will get all the info we are all after.