Topic: A Question of Salt!

[Malc.]

On a complete whim, I decided to try a small local curry take away tonight, that I had never tried before. I ordered Tandoori Chicken, Sag Aloo and Onion Bhaji.

I got to chatting to the what appeared to be the owner of this clean and tidy take away. After explaining my desire and passion to cook BIR I started throwing in the odd question at random intervals.

We discussed various things but to the answer do you use Patak's? the answer was demonstrably yes. Undeterred I awaited my fare and looked forward to eating it.

Well I was quite happy with the meal say for one major criticism, it was far too salty. All of it I mean, the Tandoori, the Bhaji and the Sag Aloo. 

I do mean to go back and try other dishes but it did make me think. Are BIR loosing their ability to season food properly with the insertion of Pastes like Patak's.

I asked him about his base and he said the chef was always "experimenting". Does this mean he is continually trying to find a good recipe or perfect an already good recipe. Over salty fare tells me they haven't perfected anything as yet, or have become numbed to taste senses.

Has anyone else noticed a similar thing where a BIR cooking with Patak's over seasons dishes with salt?

[chriswg]

I've had some very salty ones before but usually from good restaurants on a Monday or Tuesday evening when presumably the head chef is off. I doubt it has anything to do with the use of Pataks pastes, it's more likely down to an inexperienced chef trying to cook like the head chef and getting a bit carried away with the 'dipping'.

[Malc.]

What sparked my thoughts on this Chris was the fact that two of the dishes i.e. the bhaji and tandoori are prepared prior to final cooking. So any salt must have been added in a considered manor rather than in the heat of the moment. Why then add extra salt when the paste already has it in, is beyond me.

I shall be returning to try other dishes for the sake of giving them a fair crack at the whip so to speak. I'll see if I can get to sample the base whilst i'm there. He seemed quite willing to talk curry despite not having all the answers, so he might just accept my request. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

[976bar]

Good Post Axe!!

I have always used a few Indian restaurants from my location, but one in particular, which is run by ex Ghurkas used to be really good, then it went downhill so fast and remained that way for some time. Each time I ordered the same dish never mind anything else it had changed drastically.

Unfortunately, the kitchen is on another level, so I am not sure if it was the same chef trying out new ideas or whether it was just a change of chefs.

However, happily I am glad to say that this particular dish has now been back to normal on a regular basis......

So, in my mind, I am thinking that the same chef was probably experimenting with different products to produce a cheaper curry which just didn't work. I can't have been the only customer that had complained....

I also recently went to my favourite BIR and took one of my Tarka Dhals which I posted the conversation we had on.... we got chatting and he said he doesn't think the BIR will be around in ten years time...... He said there is no money in it anymore, the chefs from the past came over from India alone and cooked and cooked and cooked.... now they want their families here too and demand far too much money, hence something has to give......

But it just goes to show the changing world of the BIR and I think as someone else pointed out, that it will one day be all done in one store. Kentucky fried chicken, McDonalds style burgers, fish and chips and also BIR.

There is a place near me in Finchampstead near Wokingham. It used to be called "Bobs fish and chips". Now I liked that place as my name is Bob!! lol

BUT!!!!! It now serves, fish and chips, kebabs and BIR style curries. Just a takeaway, no seating, but nevertheless run by Indians........

No disrespect, but what do they know about fish and chips and kebabs?

You can now start to see where all this is going......... perhaps?

What are the views of others?..........

[Malc.]

It is an interesting point that you make. Part of my conversation with the owner yesterday was the cost of spices. He explained in the last year alone that the price of spice had doubled. He also said that there is is little room left for profit and that the use of Paste simply made it more profitable.

For the same reason, I feel that this is why the likes of BIR are going the way of the good old Chinese in that it is simply better business to be a jack of all trades i.e. Fish n Chips, Kebabs, Curry etc.

However, I wonder if this will spark the next evolution or at least re-invention of the BIR in it's original form. If most of the current BIR/TA's go the way of the multi-task chippy, it will leave a nice little hole for an upmarket revival of original 70/80's BIR cuisine. I'd certainly be happy to pay that little extra to get a meal cooked by a decent chef with his family on tow.

[976bar]

That is also interesting. I have been buying spices from the same store for the past 2 years, the price hasn't changed to what I buy in small quantities, which makes me feel is he telling the truth if he is buying in large quantities, or is it something else?...........

I also like the idea of that gap in the market of producing curries from the 70/80's era or even best quality BIR curries in general.......... in your mind do you think it's a viable option given the prices of produce today?

Let's here what the rest of the forum has to say on this matter.......

Just a thought here, but could it be in the future, that if viable, a certain group of people from CRO, could form a consortium of investors for such a launch and regenerate the "taste of the past"?......

[Stephen Lindsay]

I too raised my eyebrows at the mention of spices doubling in cost. I haven't calculated it but it's doesn't seem to me to be in the same league as a haulage company struggling because of the costs of diesel or petrol.

I also haven't noticed a big change in the cost of spices and let's face it, we are talking about what - at the most a tbsp or two in a curry - what's that gonna cost - about 20p I reckon. OK so there's spices in the base but again I would say spices represent a fraction of the cost of the final dish.

Now if he had said the costs of fuel and also rates etc., I might have agreed.

[Malc.]

Well I could only take him at his word. Perhaps it might be certain spices he has noticed going up in price or even perhaps his commercially sized jars of Patak's.  But you have to keep in mind that on a commercially packaged scale, companies like Patak's will make less on a commercial sized jar sold to the industry as opposed to us buying one on a shelf in a supermarket.

It might well be that whilst the public sized jars of paste and spice have not changed much in price, the commercially sized industry products may well have gone up. He also mentioned that Patak's supply him his spices as well as the pastes, so this might also have something to do with his comments.

As far as the Best Quality BIR, i'm sure something along those lines will occur. There is far too much interest in good Indian food for the market to disappear all together.

[976bar]

As far as the Best Quality BIR, i'm sure something along those lines will occur. There is far too much interest in good Indian food for the market to disappear all together.


Lets keep an eye on this for the future. You never know if a niche market opportunity will raise it's head!! .................

[gazman1976]

Im sorry but i disagree with the thought BIR's will dissapear, Glasgow and i know Birmingham have had them for 40 yrs now and when people say they cant get that flavour of the 70's or 80's  it mistifies me as several indian curry houses in Glasgow still have the same flavour as before , just my humble opinion

Garry