Topic: Thoughts on BIR curry - Six years later

[joshallen2k]

Hi All,

I finally made the trip back to the UK, 6 years after having tasted my last true BIR curry. Asides from re-acquainting myself with the complete curryhouse experience and flavour, I really wanted to see how they fared compared to my best homemade work.

I went to 3 BIR's in all. One in Richmond-on-Thames, and two in Norwich. All three were highly recommended and did not disappoint........ BIR curry is every bit as good as I remember. 

Here are a few of the key dishes I had with a short commentary:

CHICKEN MADRAS - had this twice. My first thought is that they were both much more "onion-y" than my own. It must have all come from the base, as there were no discernable pieces of onion at all. Colour was consistent with mine (reddish-brown). Tasted delicious. Very little excess surface oil. Slightly less hot than mine. I was pleasantly surprised to conclude that mine is every bit as good. This was the one I was most worried about. Didn't notice any "smokiness" or taste that I was not getting with my own (doesn't mean it wasn't there, just couldn't pick it out).

LAMB BHUNA - as expected. A little on the dry side, and comparable to Bhunas I have made. Big difference I noticed in this particular Bhuna was a definite taste of lime pickle in there!

CHICKEN TIKKA MASALA - as much work as I have put into this one, I was very surprised to find it much better than any of mine.    The tikka itself was much more mildly spiced than my usual (Blade's). The sauce was miles better than mine. More coconutty, and with less spicing than mine. As the dish sat, as the meal progressed, I noticed slight amounts of water start to pool in the sauce - something I have never seen mine do. The person I was having dinner with suggested that it may be down to using coconut milk, as opposed to powder or block. Appreciate some opinions from the forum on the likelihood of that.

SHEEK KEBABS - mine are as good.

CHICKEN JALFREZI - Not being as experienced with Jalfrezi as some of the others, it didn't stand out as being any better than the one I use (Stew's recipe). Smaller chunks of pepper/onion though.

CHICKEN PHALL - this one was identical to the Madras, but much much hotter. Again, I was surprised to see that mine were usually hotter.

KING PRAWN TIKKA - huge tiger prawns that had been split up the middle into kind of a "Y" shape. Absolutely gorgeous. Tender meat and great tikka flavour. I think I need to revisit my tandoori marinade. Mine are much more lemony and much more highly spiced than these were. Curious I did not detect any obvious yogurt in the marinade. That was part of the reason I gravitated to Blade's in the first place.

NAAN - obviously they get a better result using a real tandoor. I felt mine were passably close though using the max heat / pizza stone method. Their's were slightly sweeter than mine. Not sure if that's down to just adding sugar to the dry mix, or something else. Opinions there would be appreciated as well.

CONCLUSIONS

- Very surprised to see I nailed the Madras, but fell short on the CTM
- Going forward, I will feel much better about my own cooking. I fail to see a 5% gap anymore

And I came home to realize that the Ashoka base was finished, and its time to break out the BE and SnS for the head to head!

--- Josh

[JerryM]

Josh,

well pleased the visit came off. nice little report and very comforting in terms of status on your cooking aims towards BIR.

nothing to add other than on the water pooling front - never seen before and would not wish to follow recreating it (a best forgotton memory for me).

head to head coming soon eh!

[Yousef]

Excellent Report joshallen2k,

Have you got the link to your madras recipe?
I still love nothing better than trying a new curry house, i can been seen taking pictures of my food when it come up...i love it.

Stew

[Cory Ander]

Hi Josh,

Glad to hear that you enjoyed your trip back to "Ol' Blighty" and that the curries were up to your expectations

CHICKEN TIKKA MASALA - ...I was very surprised to find it much better than any of mine.    The tikka itself was much more mildly spiced than my usual (Blade's). The sauce was miles better than mine. More coconutty, and with less spicing than mine

Contrary to what many people seems to find, I find it far more difficult to replicate the milder curries (e.g. CTM. korma, straight "curry", etc) than the hotter dishes (e.g. madras, vindaloo, jalfrezi, etc).  I think this is because the additional spices (i.e. chilli), in the hotter dishes, actually mask the underlying flavour of the milder dishes (which, I believe, primarily comes from the base). 

As the dish sat, as the meal progressed, I noticed slight amounts of water start to pool in the sauce - something I have never seen mine do

I think this is most likely from the rice rather than the CTM.  Which rice was it?  Pilau or plain, probably?

KING PRAWN TIKKA - I need to revisit my tandoori marinade. Mine are much more lemony and much more highly spiced than these were

If you're using Pataks pastes for your tikka marinade (?), I think the "lemony" taste is most likely from all the acidic substances  in the pastes (vinegar, citric acid, tartaric acid, etc), which are distinctly noticeable and somewhat overpowering.  Personally, I would avoid these pastes (or use them in moderation, at least) if I wanted to replicate a decent  BIR CTM.

NAAN - ...Their's were slightly sweeter than mine. Not sure if that's down to just adding sugar to the dry mix, or something else. Opinions there would be appreciated as well

Probably down to sugar (or ghee..but less likely I feel).  I can't see what else it could be?

I fail to see a 5% gap anymore

That's great news Josh, but I'm amazed!   

I'd challenge ANY member to make even a simple special fried rice or mushroom bhaji comparable with a decent BIR version! 

[joshallen2k]

Hi CA, appreciate the feedback.

Contrary to what many people seems to find, I find it far more difficult to replicate the milder curries (e.g. CTM. korma, straight "curry", etc) than the hotter dishes (e.g. madras, vindaloo, jalfrezi, etc).  I think this is because the additional spices (i.e. chilli), in the hotter dishes, actually mask the underlying flavour of the milder dishes (which, I believe, primarily comes from the base). 

I'd agree with that. I did notice their curries had a stronger onion taste than mine, and did so from the base.

I think this is most likely from the rice rather than the CTM.  Which rice was it?  Pilau or plain, probably?

No, this was strictly in the CTM itself. I noticed the water as the CTM sat in the serving dish.

If you're using Pataks pastes for your tikka marinade (?), I think the "lemony" taste is most likely from all the acidic substances  in the pastes (vinegar, citric acid, tartaric acid, etc), which are distinctly noticeable and somewhat overpowering.  Personally, I would avoid these pastes (or use them in moderation, at least) if I wanted to replicate a decent  BIR CTM

Point taken. I do like what the Patak's adds in the Blade recipe, but agree on the acidity. In future I will halve the Pataks, as well as the lemon juice and go from there.

Probably down to sugar (or ghee..but less likely I feel).  I can't see what else it could be?

I guess my point was that I already put sugar in my naan mix, 2 to 3 tablespoons, and these had a different kind of sweet.

That's great news Josh, but I'm amazed!   

I'd challenge ANY member to make even a simple special fried rice or mushroom bhaji comparable with a decent BIR version! 

Well luckily I'm not a fan of special fried rice or mushroom bhaji 

What I was getting at was that after so long, the "mental gap" was greater than the reality. I'm now very happy with my cooking, especially where I am with the Madras. Just need to work on the CTM now 

-- Josh

[Cory Ander]

That's great news Josh, but I'm amazed!   

I'd challenge ANY member to make even a simple special fried rice or mushroom bhaji comparable with a decent BIR version! 

Well luckily I'm not a fan of special fried rice or mushroom bhaji 

My point being that, even with these relatively simplistic dishes, it is still very difficult to truly recreate that BIR taste and smell (i.e. sweet, savoury, depth of flavour).

[Derek Dansak]

thats great news josh, especially as there are no bir near where you live! which madras recipe do you use, and which base is your favorite? 

[joshallen2k]

DD, my usual Madras is the Bruce Edwards recipe.

On the base front, tonight I will be making my two favourites and see which fares better on a head to head: the SnS 2008 and the Bruce Edwards recipes.

I honestly though my Madras was as good or better than the Madras's I tried when I was over.

[JerryM]

josh,

is this the madras recipe u refer to http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3231.0

[joshallen2k]

Jerry, that's basically it. Though with that particular base I don't know if I'd add the teaspoon of extra garlic/ginger paste again. Its very garlicky as is. Though I am leaning to reverting to the bog standard, unmodified BE recipe.