Topic: Bobby Bhunas latest base sauce goings on

[Bobby Bhuna]

Care to quantify that BB? 

Most members on the site, from what I've heard, would say that although they can produce fairly similar curries to a BIR, still feel that they are their efforts are lacking, compared to those of a good BIR. However, using any one of the set of our more successful base recipes, most will produce curries of similarly good results.

We still have some way to go to getting it just right. Our best efforts at the base seem to plateau at a certain level, with several recipes producing very very similar end results. The result is very good, although still lacking that missing element.

We have not made much progress with this since I have become a member, with factors like economy and availability of ingredients weighing into member's judgment into the likelihood of a new ingredient's feasibility and as such many suggestions are disqualified and or written off. In the past year, I don't think that the general consensus has changed.

Having said that, I'm sure a newbie would be pretty happy with SnS's, Darthphal's, Ifindforu's or Bruce Chapman's curry base.

Assuming a new member knows one pan from the other, has the correct ingredients and a set of scales, and eats BIR fairly often, I really don't think it takes Gordon Ramsay to follow the instructions. A few attempts should iron out any obvious flaws.

I think our man has done a sterling first attempt of the Bhuna from looking at the pictures and I'm glad that he's happy with his results.

[Cory Ander]

I'm not sure to which threshold you are referring CA ... perhaps a BIR 1970's threshold?

My point was not so much about "a threshold" existing but about the assertion that "the majority of people on here think there is a threshold".  That might well be true (I can't tell, and I don't think anyone else is in a position to tell, with any certainty, either).  I've only seen a few members here (out of several thousand members) make that assertion.  I've also seen a few notable members that say quite the opposite.  I wouldn't like to see more myths being needlessly perpetuated

Nevertheless, I'm not actually fond of this "threshold" idea (as you may have gathered).  To my mind there is a continuum in the quality of curry bases and resultant curries (as with any other food product), from crap to brilliant. But I have no doubt that the "secret" to producing a decent BIR curry (I don't care from which era) primarily lies with the base.  You should be able to take an excellent base and, using minimal additional spicing, make an excellent bhuna (say) with the taste, smell and appearance of a decent BIR curry.

[Cory Ander]

Most members on the site

It's really these sweeping statements that I'm taking exception to Bobby.  How can you tell (from 7500 members)?

using any one of the set of our more successful base recipes, most will produce curries of similarly good results

Agreed.

We still have some way to go to getting it just right. Our best efforts at the base seem to plateau at a certain level, with several recipes producing very very similar end results. The result is very good, although still lacking that missing element

Agreed.

We have not made much progress with this since I have become a member

Agreed

with factors like economy and availability of ingredients weighing into member's judgment into the likelihood of a new ingredient's feasibility and as such many suggestions are disqualified and or written off

But cost and availability are totally legitimate and practical considerations Bobby. I don't think that necessarily means that suggestions are "disqualified" or written "written off" though.  But we should, nevertheless, be pragmatic in our evaluation IMHO.

[Bobby Bhuna]

It's really these sweeping statements that I'm taking exception to Bobby.  How can you tell (from 7500 members)?

You're right enough. That said, many of our more vocal members do go with the threshold thing, and as far as I'm concerned, it seems to hold for the recipes available to us right now. However, if a base sauce recipe were to come up that blew the rest out of the water, then it's a plateau we're struggling to break through, rather than a naturally existing threshold.

But cost and availability are totally legitimate and practical considerations Bobby. I don't think that necessarily means that suggestions are "disqualified" or written "written off" though.  But we should, nevertheless, be pragmatic in our evaluation IMHO.

I quite agree that these are valid considerations, however sometimes I feel ingredients and methods are discarded off hand as impractical. However we can't get it right, and if it takes couple random ingredients and ridiculous prep times to get there, then that could well be what's happening. I agree that most BIR practices must adhere to the cheap and cheerful methods, but perhaps to get it perfect, there may be trade offs here and there. This is only a suggestion, and as with so much in blind BIR reproduction, is mere speculation.

However, as you say, until we can get it right, we must continue to explore these avenues.

[Cory Ander]

sometimes I feel ingredients and methods are discarded off hand as impractical. However we can't get it right, and if it takes couple random ingredients and ridiculous prep times to get there, then that could well be what's happening

I don't disagree with that either Bobby. 

But I think we need to be careful not to jump to conclusions that, for instance, margarine (and specifically East End margarine), is likely to be used widely in curry bases, based on one recipe (PP's Ashoka curry base recipe) and the appearance of a margarine tub in a Malik video (with no other recipes or reports ever before suggesting it's use). 

The use of margarine might well be widespread, but the recipe and reports don't substantiate this assertion.  I think we should be mindful of this, least we are all encouraged to go and stick a tub of Flora in our curry bases.

Hmm...margarine...widespread..I get it! 

And Bobby, is a "Madras Maestro" a sooped up Austin Rover?   

[Bobby Bhuna]

And Bobby, is a "Madras Maestro" a sooped up Austin Rover?   

Hahaha, you should smell the fumes!!! ;D

[Cory Ander]

Hahaha, you should smell the fumes!!!

hahahaha...extinguish all naked flames?  ;D

I had you down as a Fart Mondeo man myself 

[Bobby Bhuna]

But I think we need to be careful not to jump to conclusions that, for instance, margarine (and specifically East End margarine), is likely to be used widely in curry bases, based on one recipe (PP's Ashoka curry base recipe) and the appearance of a margarine tub in a Malik video (with no other recipes or reports ever before suggesting it's use).

It really does bother me that with all these first hand accounts, we're still not getting it quite right. There's absolutely no way that most good BIRs are all using the same secret ingredient. I'm at my wits end. I think I'm going to try and progress by attempting to buy more base sauces from takeaways, this time of a higher standard than the notabley average Eastern Pavilion. If anyone else gets the chance, give it a shot and report back.

[Panpot]

Interesting reading here though as you might accept i feel inclined to defend what I witnessed on all our behalf's at The Ashoka.I suspect there is a fair bit of a difference between TAs and BIRs up and down the country but aspiring to cook the best food I can has always been my ambition so if that takes margarine and coconut block,precooked Garlic/Ginger and BunJara then so be it. Bobby I have noticed that of all the more recent enthusiasts you have yet to comment on the stuff I have posted on The Ashoka and given that you seem to be from the east of Scotland I would have thought the regional differences would be minimal. I think if you have a go with what was shared with me by an honest hard working and award winning chef you might find the basics to lift your own experimentation to new level. The Base Sauce is wonderful and the alchemy of working in the other basics he shared is well worth it and absolutely identical to what I have been searching for all these years in taste smell and texture not to mention the revealed secret about the Vegtable Pakora.

But hey I dint expect everyone to like it but its the closest I have come so now I am down to experimenting with these new tools to expand my menu. cheers Panpot

[Bobby Bhuna]

The Base Sauce is wonderful and the alchemy of working in the other basics he shared is well worth it and absolutely identical to what I have been searching for all these years in taste smell and texture not to mention the revealed secret about the Vegtable Pakora.

Cheers Panpot, this one's next on my list. I did try using puree rather than other forms of tomato and added coconut block, inspired by your recipe from Ashoka.

That said, I hate the Ashoka in Dundee, so I hope it's much better!