Topic: Who believes there is a secret ingredient to the curry base?

[Bobby Bhuna]

That may be the case but it doesn't really explain where the "tatse" and "smell" come from as you get that if you have your curry in a takeaway plastic or foil container.

It suggests that it comes from the heat involved in the cooking process.

[Chris303]

Anytime I heat one of my cast iron baltis up till they are smoking hot and I pour my just cooked curry in and everything is sizzling and smoking ---- I get the SMELL and when I taste the curry I just poured in -- i get the TASTE.
There is no secret ingredient... Its is all bout high tempratures, smoking and sizzling.

I've got to try that
Somebody bought me some balti bowls for a present
Unfortunately they got those awful stainless steel ones
They can't be heated the same
I'll have to get some cast iron baltis
Where did you get yours from?

http://www.spicesofindia.co.uk/

[Chris303]

Anytime I heat one of my cast iron baltis up till they are smoking hot and I pour my just cooked curry in and everything is sizzling and smoking ---- I get the SMELL and when I taste the curry I just poured in -- i get the TASTE.

That may be the case but it doesn't really explain where the "tatse" and "smell" come from as you get that if you have your curry in a takeaway plastic or foil container.

Because the restaurants and take aways reach these searing sizzling hot heats in their normal cooking pans, but on a home stove the white hot cast iron on contact with the food gives me the *exact* and I mean EXACT smell and taste.

[JerryM]

Tried my gas bbq (put wok straight on top of burner having taken the grill off) hoping this would deliver the last step to BIR. Alas would have to say taste was no better than electric hob.

I did get the oil smoking and amazingly the wok did set on fire after adding the garlic/ginger paste (a bit dangerous to say the least if you weren?t expecting it and I wasn?t).

The dish certainly cooked quicker (burn off of water) but there is no discernable taste difference cooking the same madras recipe between the two.

Rai advises in the Chinese rice topic 

You can?t season a wok and expect it to impart flavour immediately.  You need to use it several times (to build up a substantial patina) before you notice the smokey taste (wok hey).  The more you use it the better it gets.

So I think I need to try a few more times to be sure but i feel the omens are not that good as i would have expected at least some increase in the sort of "bbq" flavour. I really thought this would be it as I feel it is only that sort of smokey ?bbq? taste which is now the difference.

[Chris303]

what is the power output of the burner? manual should tell you.

[JerryM]

Chris,

the electric hob is 1.5kw. the bbq is 7.5kw (adelaide woody 2). the bbq burner is rectangular and longer than the wok by about 1/4 so the setup is not ideal but i thought ok for a trial.

[Davy]

Hi all,
Here's my take on it as I cook both Chinese and Indian food. I think technique has a lot to do with it but there are tricks of the trade too. Take Chinese fried rice for instance. I tried for years to get an acceptable restaurant style fried rice and in the end I cracked it.....by buying an electric rice cooker! The key problem was always too much moisture in the rice and in no other way could i get a "dry" rice other than using a rice coooker. My point here is if you follow most recipies for fried rice you can make it work using a rice cooker. Boil it as most do and things go pear shaped but most books don't tell you that!  i am sure out of all the base recipies here that at some time if not most, sources have been telling the truth about the recipies but they are using commercial equipmemnt to cook it. Also in the Curry secret KD mentions that some chefs add a teaspoon of Tandoori marinade to add extra flavour at the end of cooking. I know this to be true as I found it floating in my Lamb Karahi one night! The Lamb Poori I bought last night definately had vinegar in it, probably about a teaspoon full and also strong ginger overtones. So i believe there are certain twists at the end of cooking. Most tikka starters or chaats are seved with a slice of lemon. How many of use squeeze it on without thinking possibly not knowing that we are adding an essential ingredient ourselves - wouldn't that be something? As for the smell of your local BIR when you walk past. As has been said before. You are out on fresh air then all of a sudden you are hit by this heady aroma of spices etc. It is going to seem more intense. Let's not forget as well that what you are smelling is being thrown out buy a commercial extractor system so you are getting a mix of absolutely everything going on in that kitchen at the time, not just the curry. As for msg. I saw a chinese chef throw about dessert spoon full into the wok before cooking a chow mein one night but i also know the same restaurant buys in their noodles prepacked and "wet" from company in Manchester so again technique, ingredients and flair? MSG does add flavour to Chinese cooking but I feel Indian spices may be too strong to allow the, enhancer as it is, to make much difference. I would possibly suggest that what we may be looking for is a simple ingredient, maybe even vinegar, that cuts through the smooth oily spices to give the dish an extra dimention. It has been said elswhere that smoked paprika probably isn't used but I would dissagree. I am convinced my local carryout uses it but only in their Chefs Specials dishes. The thing about this stuff is it's hot too so you don't have to add extra Chilli powder. Corry put up a mignificent post about flaming his curries on his burner which looks like it has been wrenched off the wing of a Beoing 747 and says it makes a marked difference to his curries. Could this be because he is cooking outside in th open air? Less dulling of the smell senses? In total I think you are all being a bit hard on yourselves as I am convinced that the curries you guys are producing would sit alongside a hell of a lot of BIR curries and probably beat few as well. Just one last thing about the cooking temprature. If you look at most domestic cookers, hobs and even ranges the output is about 3.5 to 5 or 6 (can't remember if it's Kilojules or what)on the wok burner, a Chinese commercial wok burner runs at about 17! You will not find a domestic range with much more as it is rated to match a domestic canopy or extractor! what I used to do before i got a cannon range was remove the cast iron diffuser on the ring and let the flame come through straight onto the bottom of the wok - not suggesting that you do do the same ofcourse!!!  ;D       

[JerryM]

Chris,

been thinking more about my bbq burner and read the various posts searching on burner. found the posts very interesting particularly the blue flame. my bbq burner is aimed at heating up a large area ie the grill and is not really blue like my torch for plumbing.

i don't think now the test equipment was good enough and i'm on look out for a burner at a decent price.

given what you say about your cast iron baltis and the quality of the base & recipe i've got through CRO then i feel it ie hot burner can be the only missing ingredient.

[JerryM]

Davy,

nice post. very much conclude on the rice problems and i'll add to the rice post my experiences.

the secrete ingredient i often use is a splash of worcester sauce. it' seems to add a sweet smokey flavour and gets the dish closer to BIR/TA taste.

[Davy]

Back again,
I was pondering the theory of the vinegar, worcester sauce and additional theories and practices this morning. Then I had a thought that may tie in with what we all seem to think is involved in "The taste & Smell" What about some sort of pureed Indian Pickle added to the dish? We know the Indians are big on their pickles and chutneys in India etc We also know mango chutney is added to various dishes. All my locals do and Achari or pickle curry. Has any of our forum noticed large jars of Indian pickle at their local cash & carry? Has any of our intrepid investigators noticed any in a BIR kitchen?
I have found over the years that so much information can be gleaned from multiple sources and many a time I have cracked one problem or another via books I already have at home. I just couldn't see the Forrest for the trees at the time. For instance I was having "Another" Puree a week ago and got the distinct taste of coconut which I hadn't picked up before and I have used this TA quit a few times. Instantly I thought of the paste given to Annam in his base sauce post. It fits like a glove in to this theory of pates and marinades added at the end of cooking. Ta and restaurants do goof up at times and add a bit too much of something. I have had several sweet and sour sauces over the years that have been very lemony. They haven't changed the recipie just goofed up while making it!!!