Topic: How do best BIR do it

[JerryM]

How do best BIR do it 

I've posted this question before. This came of it:

1) heat destroys flavour - I've cut back on base time from 3 hrs to ~2 hrs. I aim to undercook at dish fry
2) clarity of taste - aim to add ingredients only once (not that easy but worth keeping in mind)
3) fresh is best - speaks for itself 
4) recipe refinement - small differences to key ingredients more critical than a complete set of ingredients

I'm still a long way short though.

Current focus is on how to get a better understanding of how spices work - what they bring to the curry

An example being how much turmeric in base - what's the optimum or envelope. Is it better in base or at dish fry.

Very quickly the picture becomes too big and not workable ie trial and error would take too much effort.

Any thoughts would be appreciated on all 3 questions:

1) how do best BIR do it
2) will "optimum" spicing make a difference
3) how best to explore spicing

[haldi]

I have had to re assess everything, after I had my BIR cooking lesson with Adey
I mean, there I was bringing back curries which dis satisfied me, but were fine by everybody else who tasted them

I went on the course because I wasn't totally happy with my BIR cooking
and I came back not being happy with someone else's BIR cooking

I think we are actually achieving our goal but can't appreciate it
You could chase this forever but never arrive

I would guess that you have already got exactly what you want Jerry, but don't know it

I think your taste and smell are ruined for days after a few hours of exposure to spices, onions and garlic

I have watched gravy and curries cooked in takeaways so many times
We are doing it right
And there are the videos to watch again and again

I bet I would think your curries are fantastic Jerry
I would like some of us perfectionists to get together for a curry reality check
I can't see any other way forward

[Ghoulie]

Give 3 or 4 people the same ingredients for any dish - let alone curry - and you will come up with all of them tasting differently.

Interesting one talking to my mate on this very theme some years ago & citing exactly above and our respective wives making spag bog - yet they come up completely different.  He then went on to say how he could never get his parsley sauce to taste like his grans - never tasted of parsley - no matter how much parsley he laced it with.  I watched Jamie (or was it Rick?) recently who made a passing comment about parsley sauce - leave the addition of the parsley to right at the end of the process - it is so aromatic that you can drive off this flavour when added too early.  He's tried it and it now works ok for him !!

It is this kind of precise knowledge that the very good Asian chefs have to enable them to bring out the best from the various combinations - knowing just how much & when / how to add that makes their dishes 'special'.  Sadly, i don't have this flair / feel for spices - wish I had.  I am an ex analytical chemist turned concrete technologist - specialising in chemical additives for all cement systems.  I have this flair for additives in my game - wish I could develop it into spices for asian cuisine.  Who knows if / when I retire ( i am beyond that age of 65 & still working) I may take it more seriously & apply myself to it.

[JerryM]

Ghoulie/Haldi,

you both up there as my fav posters.

yes for sure i'm more than happy with curries produced (this site has taught me well). more and more BIR's disappoint just showing how i and the site have journeyed. i'm starting to question myself - am i comparing what i like too much or just being too critical.

trouble is i have perfect example. ellesmerport is not a place i know. it has for me 2 restaurants. one that thinks its brill (really nice decor) and 1 that thinks customer. the latter has what i call curry pedigree. my wife like's the 1st. what i would call a modern BIR. so its no wonder they get lots of customer.

do i need to search for best becomes a difficult question. i like my pizza and brewing beer is what i did in 73 and now realise the technology needed is within my means.

its worth me adding a bit more detail behind the post.

what "best" BIR means. its easier to say what's not:
1) you don't need chip shop on way home (had 1 on tuesday)
2) the manger wont tell you his restaurant is best
3) it won't have a perception of Michelin star

what it will have is much more difficult to describe. so many TA are pretty good and almost there.
1) it will be Bangladeshi
2) it will have been in business since say 1970
3) it will be proud of its food
4) it wont cost an arm and leg to eat

i do accept most members wont even have this on their radar.

these are the things that set the best apart:
1) clarity of taste
2) a balance of spice
3) use of fresh ingredients that lift the dish beyond the norm
4) use of quality meat (its the spice that matters)

there are very few "best" though. i'd say in warrington 1 in 30 outlets. even my local BIR restaurant is not best so you really have to keep your blinkers off.

as for a reality check i'm 100% in favour. ive sort of tried to do this this year (met say 6 members) and have been impressed how good it's been. talking the talk posting has its limitations.

so far i guess on the reality check:
1) Haldi
2) Ghoulie

who else become very difficult - who has that passion for the curry

ps for anyone who knows warrington i would put the cottage as best (very expensive and perhaps losing it). it would be interesting in this day and age what say trip adviser puts as no 1. ive recently been to 2 off that supposedly fared well only to dissapoint (with the exception of using real coconut in CTM).

i'll try and put down my current thoughts on how im currently thinking of moving forward.

ps i dont see this as a quick journey - say 10 yr. the important thing is to satart

[Ghoulie]

You're too kind JerryM.  All I know is that I recognise a good original taste when I meet it.

I have been spoiled by living / working in the Middle East - Dubai based and travelled all over from there for work / holidays - '76 to '84 (and been back since to visit old eating haunts).  The food in Dubai is exceptional - you name it - it is there & costing from next to nothing to an arm and a leg.  I have also been to India - stayed at the Taj in Bombay - '78!!  I have had better Indian (& Pakistani food) in Dubai than Bombay.

Nothing disappoints me more than a BIR menu here in UK that reads as if they know what they are doing - only to find the same base sauce tweaked for every dish presented.  I only go once.

Interesting dish in Dubais Khyber Restaurant is their 'Special Veg' - very specific taste which I could never 'christen'.  Eating in Rusholme many many years later with my wife and we had a side dish that we both tasted  - looked at each other - and both said Khyber  'Special Veg' !  Looking at the description - I would say the taste was down to the use of mustard seed.

JerryM - your mention of brewing beer brought back many old happy memories.  My dad used to brew his own - he had a very good home brew as good as his beloved Worthington Pale Ale.  He was at it when they insisted you had a licence to brew home stuff (he didn't!).  So I got married ('68)- skint - couldn't afford the pub - so I brewed my own - and soon was experimenting to make all sorts - including a 14% proofer!!  Kicked the back of your throat that one!  My favourite tipple was Newcastle Brown - so I tried doing it & got pretty close to that special nutty taste - achieved by floating the yeast on toast to percolate through the toast to then ferment.  Chesters Mild was a request from a mate - easy peasy - use burnt malt.

[livo]

Yesterday I made the effort to remove some "older" leftovers that had become resident in the back of the fridge after having all sorts of Christmas fare poked in front of them.  The vegetable and chicken curries had decided to perform metamorphosis into unrecognisable new species, but surprisingly the small portion of leftover Lamb Rogan Josh provided the wonderful aroma of a perfect curry as soon as the lid was off.

Although there was no need for me to taste it, I did, and I'd even go so far as to say it was good.  For safety reasons I tossed it in the bin anyway, but I can say that having not eaten a curry of any type for well over a week, the aroma and flavour of a good dish was certainly there.  Even cold and old it smelled great and tasted fine.

I think that anyone who has cooked with passion and commitment to a style, has oft times found there own dishes wanting, while others who eat them truly appreciate just how good they are.  I almost always enjoy my curry dishes much more after a day or two of maturation, and for some it is essential.  Lamb and beef dishes just don't fully develop immediately in my opinion.

Nothing disappoints me more than a BIR menu here in UK that reads as if they know what they are doing - only to find the same base sauce tweaked for every dish presented.  I only go once.

This is an interesting thing to say.  A lot of what I've found in my research tells me that BIR is exactly that.

[haldi]

what it will have is much more difficult to describe. so many TA are pretty good and almost there.
1) it will be Bangladeshi
2) it will have been in business since say 1970
3) it will be proud of its food
4) it wont cost an arm and leg to eat

ok
lets start completely from nothing
Can you make a madras or vindaloo that are like the above?

[Peripatetic Phil]

For safety reasons I tossed it in the bin anyway ...

Madness.  I eats anything that doesn't climb out of the 'fridge by itself !
** Phil.

[livo]

So much other food at this time there was just no room for it. I was actually surprised to find it was still in good condition compared to the other dishes cooked on the same day.

[Garp]

what it will have is much more difficult to describe. so many TA are pretty good and almost there.
1) it will be Bangladeshi

I'm surprised, Jerry, that you believe there are no good Punjabi restaurants......