Topic: Balti Chicken Madras 2 ways

[JerryM]

Livo,

Your a double of me. Love your interest.

Could you list the ingredients. Also when the whole spice is added.

I can't say I'm sold on balti madras but most won't realise that balti is very different. I know lots of BIR pass it off exactly as you say.

A suggestion would be to leave the meat out. That way your taste buds focus on the curry sauce. Get that right and it's win win

Difficult from the pic but I feel sure you should try some of the site bases.

[livo]

Been asleep over here. To answer some of the points made.

Food colouring, as I said, is not something I ever do, other than very rarely in Tandoori Chicken.  I saw the video on a chef putting red food dye powder in the batch of Tomato Sauce and just thought I'd see how much liquid dye it would take to change the colour of a small dish.  Purely experimental and judging by the response here it won't be something I'll do too often in the future.  Also note that the photos you are referring to were cooked during the early evening and taken under artificial light, whereas the Book Version was made in the mid day under natural light.  This makes it seem much redder than it actually was.

JerryM:- The sauce from the Book Version eaten on it's own was delicious.  There was left over after I'd taken it out of the pan and into the takeaway foil tray so I ate it. Yum.

The ingredient list for both preps were exactly the same.
Fresh
300 grams Chicken Breast
3 Small onions (2 medium)
3 Tbsp Tomato Puree (not Paste)
1 tsp Garlic Paste
1 tsp Ginger Paste
1 Green Chilli (seeded and chopped finely)
Juice of 1 Fresh Lemon

Whole Spices  (only the curry leaves were called for in the original recipe list)
1 Green Cardamom Pod
Tiny piece of Cassia Bark (only 1" by 1/4")
4 or 5 Black Peppercorns
Pinch of cumin Seed
4 Curry Leaves  ( I'll have to check back on what I did to recall when I used these. You might see them show up in the pics.)

Powdered Spices
1 1/2 tsp ground Coriander
1 tsp Kashmiri Chilli powder ( I only used 1/2 tsp as I needed my family to try it)
1/4 tsp ground Fennel Seed
1/4 tsp Tumeric
large pinch ground fenugreek

Other
1 tsp Salt
300 ml Water
Vegetable Oil as required / preferred
Chopped Coriander leaves to garnish (optional)

Book Version  (dead easy / bordering on lazy)

Essentially the tomato puree, water, lemon juice and all the powdered spices are combined in a bowl and set aside.

Cut up the onion and fry in oil, adding the salt and G/G pastes part way through the cooking.  The original recipe here did not call for any whole spices but I put them in at the frying stage just so both dishes had all the exact same ingredients. I guess they should be fried off first to season the oil. I didn't as they were an afterthought part way through.

When the onion is done (clear) add the chicken pieces and fry off for 2 minutes to seal.

Add the tomato Puree mixture and stir through while bringing up to heat.

Cover and simmer for 8 - 10 minutes.

Garnish with chopped green chilli and coriander if used.

BIR Style  (required extra water for Base Gravy)

Note:- this version actually ended up with only about 1 full onion in the final dish as I did not use anywhere near the full amount of Base Gravy.  This probably explains why the Book Version is a more robust dish.

You should be able to follow the pictures.
I used 1/2 an onion and part of the tomato puree along with a bit of the salt, 1/2 the G/G paste and the whole spices, turmeric and mix powder to precook the chicken. Small amount of oil and water to cover.  This took about 20 minutes.

Link to pre-cooked chicken. http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,13291.0.html#new

I used 2 whole onions to prepare a small batch of AP/JV Original Base Gravy, very thin.

I then used the remaining 1/2 onion, G/G paste, powdered spices and Tomato puree to Tarka.

Added spoon by spoon Base Gravy till I had what I thought was enough sauce in the pan.

Added the pre-cooked chicken and heated through.

Garnish and serve.

(note) judging by the above feedback, do not add RED PILLAR BOX colouring agent.

I'm not even sure this is "Balti".  The book in question describes Balti style as mild curries then gives recipes for "Balti Madras" and "Balti Vindaloo".

[Donald Brasco]

Purely experimental and judging by the response here it won't be something I'll do too often in the future. 

A word of advice livo - cook for yourself and do what pleases you and the people you cook for. There are plenty of opinions expressed here but if you let yourself be swayed you'll never make any progress towards your own goals.  That's a general point, not anything specifically about food colouring - just that accepting someone else's advice just because they seem more experienced is very dangerous on here.

[littlechilie]

Interesting comparison, and a good topic, thanks for the effort! Myself I like cooking BIR rather than traditional, I find I like the natural colour of my food.

[livo]

DB:- I'm here to learn as much as I can.  I take everything in and absorb what suites me.  I am not a fan of artificial anything in food and as a rule I don't use colouring agents.  It was just a bit of a trial to see how it went.  I do understand where you are coming from though and thanks.

[JerryM]

livo,

many thanks for detail info - appreciated.

only the curry leaves and fenugreek seed being a no no for me (never been able to gel with either although i've over time and hard cooking got to like the methi). rest looks really nice. think i might give the book version a quick go.

just to be clear - base is used in the BIR version where as the book version produces its own.

ps not fully convinced on the benefit of frying whole spice in oil. it's an area i will work on at some point. gut feeling so far is just adding them early is enough (re bunjarra method). i know traditional teaching is to add to the oil. if you taste the oil it don't really take on much flavor c/w the water based sauce.

[livo]

just to be clear - base is used in the BIR version where as the book version produces its own.

That is correct.  The Book version is so easy.  You basically combine the Tomato, LJ, water and powdered spices in a bowl then leave it.  Cook your onion and chicken with the other stuff then add the contents of the bowl.  The sauce will contain onion pieces as small as you cut them but it was a very tasty dish and was better the following day.

Also note that I used Kashmiri Chilli (Degi Mirch) and only 1/2 the quantity specified and it was hot enough for me.  If you like chilli use the full amount.

I'll scan the page and post the image for you.  Hope copyright isn't a problem here for you mods. If it is let me know and I'll PM it to you or anybody who wants it.  Scan is very big on the web page. Scroll over to the right to see the Madras recipe or right click and save it / print it.

[JerryM]

livo,

many thanks for scan. got very clear jpeg.

hoping to give it a go this week. many thanks.

[JerryM]

Had inkling livo knows cooking.

This book recipe did not disappoint. It is a traditional version and had to make closer to BIR to suit my buds - in short left out the curry leaf and blended. Rest to spec.

Loved it. Really quick and easy to make. Not BIR for sure.

Its a tad like staff curry but c/w iffu recipe much quicker to make.

Going fwd I would set the onion off straight away then mix the wet ingredients in parallel.

I'm not sure how much effect the browning of the onion has. I have tried this in base before and a reason for revisiting in this recipe. You need to use wok. I used 3kw for about 15 mins and chopped onions fine 3mm sq.

I like fennel and found the balance spot on (there but you could not pick it out).

It's not quite a 10 recipe. I don't know what it needs (I guess I'm being unfair in unconsciously comparing with my norm BIR which is wrong)

Gut feeling is the coriander is just a tad too much. Going to have to think about how the spicing could be tweaked a little.  Rest I would not change.

I think this recipe might just be what I've needed to push my knowledge of the spice envelope. Got my mind racing.

It really is perfect for midweek curry.

Spot on livo

Ps will add pics from desktop

[livo]

Glad you liked it.  I found it so simple to do, and as you say, easy to modify in method and spices.  The BIR style dish I produced, with a very bland base, come out pretty well too. Just as nice but different.  I agree it is not a 10 but the potential is there for improvement.  I love the zing of the lemon against the chilli.  Really good.

I had my "Cooking Badge" by age 9. (dib dib dib, dob, dob, dob).   I often cook Thai, Chinese, Japanese, Mexican, Greek, Italian, and anything else I feel like trying.  Sometimes though, you just can't beat a barbequed sausage and onion with tomato sauce and yellow mustard on a piece of white bread. Snag Sanga. Trying to perfect my Cha Shao or Char Sui at the moment at my son's insistence.