Topic: How to achieve high cooking temperatures at home.

[Gav Iscon]

Personally I prefer thigh to breast, specially if it's on the bone as I find breast can be too dry sometimes.

Can't argue there and I that applies for me for most dishes, Indian or otherwise.

[Malc.]

Intrigued by this recurring use of "dark meat"; first Axe (I think) and now Gav (via others).  I always thought that "dark meat" was the sole perquisite of prissy Americans and/or a hangover from the Victorian era.  Do people really use "dark meat" rather than "leg", "thigh" or whatever ?

** Phil.

My reference to dark was purely as I couldn't tell if it was drum or thigh, as it was already pulled from the carcass the day before. Otherwise I would refer to dark as being drum, thigh or leg. On the COFIDS spreadsheet commissioned by the FSA, chicken meat is referred to as white or dark.

I much prefer the dark meat to white, it has much better flavour, the best bit for me is the oyster.

[Peripatetic Phil]

My reference to dark was purely as I couldn't tell if it was drum or thigh, as it was already pulled from the carcass the day before. Otherwise I would refer to dark as being drum, thigh or leg. On the COFIDS spreadsheet commissioned by the FSA, chicken meat is referred to as white or dark.  I much prefer the dark meat to white, it has much better flavour, the best bit for me is the oyster.

I was just intrigued by the choice of language, given that I have always thought of "light and dark meat" as being classic Victorian euphemisms for "breast" and "leg" respectively.  Indeed, Anderson & Taylor [1] report that "Queen Victoria coined the phrases 'light' and 'dark meat' for chicken and other fowl because she thought mentions of the words 'breast' and 'leg' would cause men to be overcome by lust ...".  I also recall reading an exchange that allegedly took place at a Southern States dinner party where a guest was asked if she would like breast or leg : "Damn your impertinence, Sir", she is said to have responded "I'll have a little of the dark meat, if I may ?".

As regards preferences : for me, breast in a classic curry (Madras, whatever); ambivalent about Tandoori Chicken; chopped drumsticks (chopped through the bone) for Chicken with Oyster Sauce and Chinese Mushrooms, boned thigh for Chicken with Chillia & Bloack Bean Sauce, breast from a carved bird.

** Phil.
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[1] Andersen, Margaret L.  & Taylor, Howard Francis : Sociology With Infotrac: Understanding a Diverse Society, Wadsworth Publishing Co Inc, April 2005.

[Secret Santa]

"Queen Victoria coined the phrases 'light' and 'dark meat' for chicken and other fowl because she thought mentions of the words 'breast' and 'leg' would cause men to be overcome by lust ...".

And how right she was! 

[JerryM]

i get a massive difference cooking at high heat. my burner is ~9kw but i don't feel you need quite as much heat - something like 7.5kw would be the min.

for me you can't use it in the kitchen - it has to be in a shed or for myself in a garage.

the pan also makes a difference. i've not tried ali and have black steel. i also think the flame is important. it can't just be a blue bunsen burner rocket flame - it needs to wrap around the pan.

the base also needs to be right ie thin.

there are quite a lot of posts to search on. a pic of my flame is there too.

for anyone serious about BIR don't be fooled by the conjecture - for a few quid for a stove is it really worth agonizing over.

i have to load up a tray and carry it 30 steps round the house - i can tell you i would not do this if i could get the same on my 4kw domestic gas hob.

in short if you smell that BIR smell in the high street and your not getting it at home then you're not getting BIR taste. yes you can get a very good curry on a hob but once you've tasted the difference you will never go back.

[Secret Santa]

Although I haven't tried the 9kW burner Jerry I still don't agree for two main reasons.

First, most BIRs are not cooking on 9kW burners.

Second if, as I stated earlier, I cook on my 4.5kW burner and in the same style as I've seen it done dozens of times on videos from BIRs, the curry is boiled away to nothing in far too rapid a time. I see chefs cooking curries for 7 minutes and more. If I tried this I'd have a pan of curry paste left.

Now I don't dispute that cooking on a 9kW burner may impart something extra to the dish (but only if it's burning the aerosolised oil/water mix - again something most BIR chefs are not doing, except by accident or for show), however I do dispute that that is anything to do with the BIR flavour - it's just a pleasant (so you say) added extra.

[spiceyokooko]

First, most BIRs are not cooking on 9kW burners.

Interesting that when I say it, it's ...nonsense, yet when Jerry says the same thing it's, you don't agree. 

So what Kw burners are they cooking on then and have you been round every one to check?

[Secret Santa]

First, most BIRs are not cooking on 9kW burners.

Interesting that when I say it, it's ...nonsense, yet when Jerry says the same thing it's, you don't agree. 

Yes, but you're a smart-arsed git, and Jerry's not. 

So what Kw burners are they cooking on then and have you been round every one to check?

I'm judging purely by the few I've seen in BIR kitchens myself and the innumerable ones I've seen on Youtube videos etc. It's fairly easy to tell that most aren't all that much more powerful than my domestic 4.5kW and the ones that are are rarely used at full power.

[parker21]

hi guys i believe haldi is the only to answer this question as, now imay be wrong but, he bought an ex BIR burner for 150gbp a few years ago! here http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php/topic,2894.0.html

regards
gary

[spiceyokooko]

It's fairly easy to tell that most aren't all that much more powerful than my domestic 4.5kW and the ones that are are rarely used at full power.

And as I've said repeatedly in this thread, it's not about full power heat output, but constant heat.

The only major difference between what we do at home and what happens in a commercial BIR kitchen is the heat output of the burners. CA, Jerry, myself, Haldi have all done experiments on high output burners and we're all saying it makes a difference, that can't be discounted as being wrong, even though in your opinion it may not be the answer for you.

That may also not be the answer for a lot of people, which is rational given that not everyone is at the same level of ability. What I think is missing in my dishes may not be the same as what you think is missing and so on. There's no one size fit's all answer here for everyone. What works for one person may well not work for someone else.

This is an issue that seems to be cropping up a lot on here at the moment, the assumption is of course that everyone is at the same ability level, an assumption that in my opinion is clearly not correct.

And to just throw another observation into the mix to complicate things even more (which also goes to explain a number of opinions on this issue) is that not all BIR style dishes respond as well to being cooked on high output burners as others might.

I've found a Dhansask and Korma eg cook perfectly well on a domestic burner as a high output one whereas a Bhuna and Madras don't. Quite why that might be, I have no idea, but that's what I've found.