Curry Recipes Online
Curry Base Recipes => Curry Base Chat => Topic started by: RubyDoo on October 24, 2012, 07:29 AM
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There are many recipes from very well respected sources for base gravy but some skim the scum and others implicitly say not to as this contains much of the taste.
What do you do and more importantly , why? Have you tried both?
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I leave the scum in place and stir in. Yes, I have skimmed : it seemed a complete wast of time !
** Phil.
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I've also done both, and definitely found it nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune...
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defo skim for me. it's not a huge difference.
i find the "technique" important - regular stirring. this seems to stop the oil from rising (which you don't want to skim off for sure) whilst giving a long enough window ~20 mins to get all the scum out in skim form.
i get something like 300ml from a ~ 4L base.
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I don't think there's any hard and fast rules on this ??? . It does seem as though it is very much a personal preference. I have skimmed and not skimmed. To be honest, IMHO i didn't notice any difference when i tucked in to the end results ::)
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I agree with Jerry,, regular stirring will stop scum, but if it does appear, I will almost certainly stir it back in..
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defo skim for me. it's not a huge difference.
i find the "technique" important - regular stirring. this seems to stop the oil from rising (which you don't want to skim off for sure) whilst giving a long enough window ~20 mins to get all the scum out in skim form.
i get something like 300ml from a ~ 4L base.
Sometimes a bit confusing to follow Jerry
Is that 300ml of scum or oil from a 4L base? :D
Hi RubyDoo
It's probably down to knowing what scum is that your looking for on the final simmer.
If you think of it as three layers on the very surface of the base.
The Base, The Oil and The Scum.
If you move the scum slightly to one side underneath is the oil, likewise underneath the oil is the base.
If you actually taste the scum, its pretty grim and bitter, because like any scum its the impurities
created by the boiling process and in this case oil separation.
It really is hard to believe some people think it has a value and a good taste.
It's similar to a BIR Chef doing a huge pan of precooked Lamb or Beef, the first stage is to quickly
boil the meat to get rid of it's impurities (in the form of Scum) This is washed away, fresh water added
then the clean meat is precooked.
Each to his own, but that's my take on scum and why I don't want to eat it.
I also never make a base Garabi without a sieve to get the correct texture. ;)
cheers Chewy
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BIR bases aside, for me the so-called scum is where all the flavour lies. Throw away the scum from steak-and-kidney, or the scum from rabbit (both of which produce copious amounts) and you lose most of the flavour of the final dish.
** Phil.
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I stir it back in. I don't think removing it is worth the effort.
I have no idea what "impurities" may be in it or what the "impurities" may be? Anyone?
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If you actually taste the scum, its pretty grim and bitter, because like any scum its the impurities
created by the boiling process and in this case oil separation.
It really is hard to believe some people think it has a value and a good taste.
I can't relate to that at all. I don't always get scum but when I do it has always tasted, if not pleasant, then at least not unpleasant and certainly not bitter. I always stir it back in.
And what are these impurities exactly? Food in = food out.
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If you look at the chef cooking a base in The Little India Restaurant(the one where CBM filmed and kindly posted the footage) you can see he has a technique of swirling the froth/scum around leaving it in the base.Clearly he does not see the need to skim,if it's good enough for him then I'm not going to argue!!
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I've always skimmed, just because CT does it in his video and it's just become automatic. I do worry that I'm losing some valuable oil with the scum though.
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Sometimes a bit confusing to follow Jerry
Is that 300ml of scum or oil from a 4L base? :D
i try to post factually (what i do not what i think) to avoid aggravation which we all don't need or want. the english obviously suffers as a result. must try better but always happy to clarify when needed.
the 300ml is foamy scum.
clearly each to their own on this one as there very different views. i've tried both and can relate totally to chewytikka's words. i always skim full stop - i don't need to ponder the idea as i know the difference.
some bases produce more scum than others. i think the scum comes from the veg and some veg seem to give off more scum than others.
i know that some BIR don't skim.
i know that the technique for removing the scum is not easy to carry out - it's not easy to keep the oil, base and scum separate and there is only a limited window (~20 mins) before it becomes impossible to keep the scum and oil separate. by stirring the base now and then during this say 20 min window the oil can be kept dissolved in the base leaving frequent opportunities when the scum has resurfaced to remove it with a chef spoon.
as with a lot in BIR this is real fine tuning which i see essential to produce best. if other things in the BIR mix are not right then you won't see any difference between stirring it in or skimming it off.
essentially depends on your own personal outlook.
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Thank you for taking the time to reply.. Will try both me thinks.
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took a pic while i was making base - 100ml was the amount skimmed off
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/2229ccda16f297224912010988070d22.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#2229ccda16f297224912010988070d22.jpg)
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proud to keep the scum
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Hi Jerry
Cooked this pan of Garabi this morning.
Well actually, a full bodied medium curry for someones party tonight.
Took the pics to show what I mean, when I say scum.
Very little removed on the finished Garabi, about a Chef's spoon.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/cfd3920836fd32aa498cd9bb3fd13476.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#cfd3920836fd32aa498cd9bb3fd13476.jpg)
Still a few bits here and there, floating on the oil, but near enough. :D
cheers Chewy
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chewytikka,
brill photo's they show it very clearly.
when i 1st started on curry i did not know what was meant by "scum" and it took an unnecessary amount of time for me to get confident on what it was. these photo's will help anyone who was still insure on what it is and of course has an interest in its removal. all the posts above putting the case for or not sufficiently well.
the only slight remaining interest i have is why some base produce more than others. the ifindforu for example produces 300 ml against what was 100ml for mytake. i think the rajver produces ~300ml too. i am pretty sure it must be down to type of vegetable (i use the same proportion of bulk veg in all base).
i never peel carrot and feel this does not make much difference to the amount of scum. in this particular base for the 1st time i did not peel the garlic and expected an increase which did not occur.
in reality the amount i suppose does not matter for either viewpoint. my interest really being aimed at the taste of oil and is a long term interest just to understand more about the general subject of curry.
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chewytikka,
i did not peel the garlic and expected an increase which did not occur.
MMmmm - I assume you sieve the base then? get rid of all that garlic skin?
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RubyDoo,
i always use stick blender on the base. i guess the skin must have stayed in the base or been a very small part of the scum. i used 40g of garlic so not a great amount of skin. i could not detect any change in taste to the base eitherway. it was something i'd thought to do for a while just out of ease. i intend to adopt as standard. the only slight downside is that you have to be sure the garlic is fresh and no defeats "brown" spots.
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....because like any scum its the impurities created by the boiling process and in this case oil separation. It really is hard to believe some people think it has a value and a good taste.
No it isn't, impurities that is.
It's actually coagulated lipoproteins, proteins combined with lipids (fats). Proteins when combined with lipids when boiled coagulate and have a lower density than oil and water and so float to the surface. The only effect they have on stock or base gravy is to make it cloudy. Given that base gravy is opaque anyway, they really don't make any difference whether you stir them back in or skim them off.
It's similar to a BIR Chef doing a huge pan of precooked Lamb or Beef, the first stage is to quickly boil the meat to get rid of it's impurities (in the form of Scum) This is washed away, fresh water added then the clean meat is precooked.
Still peddling the old unscientific monkey-magic, without actually understanding it then Chew ;)
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the only way for any member to get benefit from this question (if they are still unsure) is to try it for themselves - side by side ie make 2 off portions of base exactly the same and skim one and leave the other.
this is what i've done.
yes it's not a significant difference and for some it may not be important (other aspects of their curry are not right). what i've found though is that these very small differences when added together are worth it.
i love my theory but it only goes so far - eating is the only proof.
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Have to say, no way is it similar to boiling a pan of meat etc. totally different 'scum'. Who has animal fats in their base?
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.........and yes I do stir it back. Or rather I use the ladle 'method'. ;)