Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: Whandsy on January 09, 2012, 08:11 PM
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With all the recent discussion about tsp, dessert sp, tbsp and chef spoon, I thought i'd throw another huge variable into the equation.
Whilst cooking ifindforu's final base recently, it became very apparent, the size of the stock pot! When a recipe calls to half fill the pot with water etc, that can be a great difference, not only that, cook on a low light for "about an hour". The reduction of the gravy can differ enormously if the pan's tall/thin against short and wide or indeed somebodies interpretation of a low light against another's. If the gravy's over reduced and the recipe calls to double the remaining amount with water then still another mistake.
I pm'd ifindforu and he said the pan should be about 1 ft wide and about 10 inches tall. Bigger than i would have thought!
This is by no means aimed at terry / ifindforu as he kindly bothered to pm me back, but rather an enquiry as to what other members use as their stock pot size of choice ???
Wayne
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Hi Wayne
Just go to your nearest Asian Food Supermarket and buy
the right tool for the job, 1 foot X 10inch Ally curry pot will be around a 10ltr
more than ample for any base recipe on cR0 and will last for years.
I've got 2x5ltr, 10ltr, 20ltr, and a jumbo 40ltr which doesn't get aired very often.
cheers ChewyPots
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Hi Wayne,
It is a good point that you raise. I would also add to this, you may remember my remarks with regards to the amount of veg/onions that I'd witnessed in my local TA's stock pot, and that of c2g and Dipuraja? The onions clearly over filling the pot. With regards to the c2g base, doesn't he say to add the same amount of water as you have gravy?
So, if I have this correct, his pot looked like a 5L pressure cooker style pot. His veggies/onions came above the brim of the pot and he added about 750ml of liquid (water & oil). Once cooked, it appeared to have around 4L of gravy ingredients before the water was added. Blend, then add equal amounts of water, so, the there would have been around 6-7L of gravy before the 'seasoning' was added.
So with that observed, that rule could apply to any size pot that you use, as long as you stick with the c2g method. Where this methodology falls down, is the amount of spices that you would add to achieve what c2g intends us to? Plus, with the added ambiguity of the exact measurement of a chefspoon, it's always going to give varied results.
I've got to admit, I've never tried to do a gravy with so many solid ingredients and very little liquid as c2g or Dipuraja. It's quite amazing to see actually how much liquid is in the pot once the onions have cooked before blending, especially as he makes no mention to using a lid, which of course would slow down any liquid evaporation.
Ray :)
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I've got 2x5ltr, 10ltr, 20ltr, and a jumbo 40ltr which doesn't get aired very often.
Bloody hell chewy, you have got some equipment, 40 ltr, that'd feed a street! Haha
I've got to admit, I've never tried to do a gravy with so many solid ingredients and very little liquid as c2g or Dipuraja. It's quite amazing to see actually how much liquid is in the pot once the onions have cooked before blending, especially as he makes no mention to using a lid, which of course would slow down any liquid evaporation.
Ray, C2G's base is gonna be my next effort. I have a few ifindforu bases left so it won't be for a short while yet.
My biggest concern is exactly what you've said above, just how much liquid comes out of the veg! I can't believe how that pot differed, I wonder if the overcrowding of the pot helps release this as i noticed he states this is important in one of the other threads?
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I followed C2G's base sauce recipe in terms of ingredients but used my 6.5l slow cooker overnight. As ray says, it's incredible how much liquid appears during the first cooking, all coming out of the veg. It was a leap of faith to turn the slow cooker on and leave it overnight when it was practically dry, but lo and behold in the morning it was half full of liquid.
Following the blending and adding spices it had another 4 or 5 hours on "high" as per the C2G method of cooking post blending, and during this time the sauce darkened and became richer in flavour.
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Glad to hear that natterjak, what did you think of the finished base? Much different to any others?
W
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Yes, far less undercooked in flavour than the Ashoka and Abdul bases I'd tried before. The 2nd cooking post blending really seems to develop the flavour even to the point where some caramelisation seems to start. The resulting curries are sweeter and richer in flavour IMHO
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The resulting curries are sweeter and richer in flavour IMHO
Good I'm up for that ;)
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The resulting curries are sweeter and richer in flavour IMHO
Good I'm up for that ;)
Me too but I never really got a definitive answer with regards to the oil. My oil has mainly been used for bhajis, samosas and onion rings but it has done the odd batch of frozen chips, not too many mind.! Some say it should be fine, some strongly dissagree. Julian from c2g never responed either way, so I'm not sure what to do?
Ray :)
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I followed C2G's base sauce recipe in terms of ingredients but used my 6.5l slow cooker overnight. As ray says, it's incredible how much liquid appears during the first cooking, all coming out of the veg. It was a leap of faith to turn the slow cooker on and leave it overnight when it was practically dry, but lo and behold in the morning it was half full of liquid.
Following the blending and adding spices it had another 4 or 5 hours on "high" as per the C2G method
of cooking post blending, and during this time the sauce darkened and became richer in flavour.
natterjak , the C2G base recipe (going by julians video) does not state the base should heated on ' high' but low as per the first stage.
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The resulting curries are sweeter and richer in flavour IMHO
Good I'm up for that ;)
Me too but I never really got a definitive answer with regards to the oil. My oil has mainly been used for bhajis, samosas and onion rings but it has done the odd batch of frozen chips, not too many mind.! Some say it should be fine, some strongly dissagree. Julian from c2g never responed either way, so I'm not sure what to do?
Ray :)
Ray,
Have made the C2G base twice now,the first time with some 'well seasoned' ::) bhaji oil,the second with spiced oil I made using whole spices and I think the resultant curries using the bhaji oil had the best flavour of the two.How healthy using well used bhaji oil in the base I don't know :-\
I recently replaced the oil in my mini fryer and there was 'gunk' stuck to the bottom of it so if I do use bhaji oil again I think it will be from a not so well used batch of oil :)
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The resulting curries are sweeter and richer in flavour IMHO
Good I'm up for that ;)
Me too but I never really got a definitive answer with regards to the oil. My oil has mainly been used for bhajis, samosas and onion rings but it has done the odd batch of frozen chips, not too many mind.! Some say it should be fine, some strongly dissagree. Julian from c2g never responed either way, so I'm not sure what to do?
Ray :)
Ray,
Have made the C2G base twice now,the first time with some 'well seasoned' ::) bhaji oil,the second with spiced oil I made using whole spices and I think the resultant curries using the bhaji oil had the best flavour of the two.How healthy using well used bhaji oil in the base I don't know :-\
I recently replaced the oil in my mini fryer and there was 'gunk' stuck to the bottom of it so if I do use bhaji oil again I think it will be from a not so well used batch of oil :)
I think i'm gonna try the base made with a third each of mild chalice oil, hot chalice oil and vegetable oil, that way its not too hot nor too expensive to make ;)
Thanks chaps :)
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Guy's not really on topic I guess but as it was discussed in this thread, I thought I'd continue with it.
Earlier in the thread I mentioned on how amazed I was at the amount of liquid that the c2g base ends up with in the pot at the end of the first boil, especially when there is very little liquid in there from the start. Well, I'm in the middle (at the end of the first boil) of an experimental base, loosely based on the c2g and wow, the pot is over 2 thirds full of liquid...!
My ingredients so far;
12 tennis ball size onions,
1 whole bulb of garlic
1 large green pepper
a 'thumb' size piece of ginger, sliced
handful of coriander stalks
3 cauliflower florets
3 broccoli florets
1 400g tin of plum toms, including juice
1 can of water, (can from the toms)
500ml of unseasoned oil
1 tbs of table salt
0.5 tsp Asafoeteda (This was the cheap yellow powdered variety)
1 knorr chicken stock pot (you know, those little jelly thingy's)
I put the pan on the heat at around 8pm tonight, with the lid on. I placed it on the smallest ring on my hob, at it's lowest setting and it's 23.05pm, and only just done. God knows how Julian suggests only 1 hr, without any mention of using a lid? A good three hours for me to be able to put a spoon through the onions, with little resistance.
It's too late for me to mess about adding the spices and blending now, so I will turn off the heat and blend tomorrow. At a quick guess, I reckon that this is going to give me about 7L of base once finished, if I follow Julians suggestion of adding the same amount of water as I have blended gravy.
Will update tomorrow........watch this space, as the saying goes :o
Ray :)
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Hi ray
Good to hear you had success with the liquid content :)
Did you do the pot overcrowding thing with the veg as julian recommends?
W
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Hi Wayne,
Hi ray
Good to hear you had success with the liquid content :)
Did you do the pot overcrowding thing with the veg as julian recommends?
No, I didn't go quite that far although I would say that it was up to the brim. Certainly, once the liquid was added to the pot, you couldn't visibly see it but you most certainly can now.
Ray :)
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Hi Ray
Am i right in thinking that you put the onions in whole, peeled but not chopped?, or do you chop them up?, also whats the finnished base like compared to terrys (info whatever his name is!!), as i like the idea of cauli and maybe even broccoli, i even toyed with the idea of putting in some sweet corn, any thoughts everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Regards
Andy
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Ok,
So I have just blended up the onion mixture before adding further water, and my 'guesstimation' seems to be on track. I've got 3.5L of what can only be described as a "thick wallpaper paste" onion puree in my pan. So, to use Julians method, I need to add a further 3.5L of water to thin out the puree?
Now, and here's the question, how much spice do I add to this to make it a usable base? I don't really want to go with Julians '1 chefspoon of this, and 1 chefspoon of that, much preferring to go with a quantity of my own mix powder but not quite sure how much.
Any suggestions?
Ray :)
p.s, Just for information, I worked out the volume of my onion pure using;
Volume = pi x radius x radius x height
Volume = 3.14159 x 12.5 x 12.5 x 7
Volume = 3436 cubic cm, 1 cubic cm = 1 ml
3436ml = 3.43L (3.5L rounded up)
It's been a while so please, correct me if my calculations are wrong :-\
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Hi Ray
Am i right in thinking that you put the onions in whole, peeled but not chopped?, or do you chop them up?, also whats the finished base like compared to terrys (info whatever his name is!!), as i like the idea of cauli and maybe even broccoli, i even toyed with the idea of putting in some sweet corn, any thoughts everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Regards
Andy
Hi Andy,
Yes the onions are peeled but left whole. My reason for this is, a) because that is how Julian from curry2go seems to do it and, b) I wanted to test just how long it would take to cook the onions on the lowest possible light. Now Julian suggests that it should only take about an hour but for me, it took nigh on 3 hrs. Obviously my 'low light' must be much lower than his?
As for the cauli and broccoli, I didn't have any cabbage but I wanted to press on while I was in the mood. I have never used them before so I hope they're going to be ok (I hate veggies of any kind with a passion)
My main reason for doing this experiment is to get an angle on the actual process. Julians is quite different in the fact that everything is cooked very very slowly. I'm still quite amazed at just how much liquid I have in the pan before adding further water. Remember I started off with only 500ml of oil, 486ml of water and 486ml of tinned toms inc juice. 1472ml of liquid in total at the start, to end up with almost 3500ml of liquid after the first boil.
I did use a lid to reduce evaporation and boy did it just do that?
Ray :)
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Now, and here's the question, how much spice do I add to this to make it a usable base? I don't really want to go with Julians '1 chefspoon of this, and 1 chefspoon of that, much preferring to go with a quantity of my own mix powder but not quite sure how much.
Any suggestions?
Hi Ray
I suggest 1 teaspoon c2go spices, or 2 H-tbs of your own Mixed Powder
cheers Chewy
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Ok,
So I have just blended up the onion mixture before adding further water, and my 'guesstimation' seems to be on track. I've got 3.5L of what can only be described as a "thick wallpaper paste" onion puree in my pan. So, to use Julians method, I need to add a further 3.5L of water to thin out the puree?
Now, and here's the question, how much spice do I add to this to make it a usable base? I don't really want to go with Julians '1 chefspoon of this, and 1 chefspoon of that, much preferring to go with a quantity of my own mix powder but not quite sure how much.
Any suggestions?
Ray :)
That was going to be my worry as well Ray he does seem to put a lot of chef spoons in :-\, I plan on using 2 heaped dessert spoons of mixed powder when i make it. What are you thinking? :)
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That was going to be my worry as well Ray he does seem to put a lot of chef spoons in :-\, I plan on using 2 heaped dessert spoons of mixed powder when i make it. What are you thinking? :)
Hi Ray
I suggest 1 teaspoon c2go spices, or 2 H-tbs of your own Mixed Powder
cheers Chewy
Well it seems that you both have a similar thing in mind, so I'm going to pop over to the c2g vids and remind myself of what spices he puts in, not forgetting the methi powder ;)
Ray :)
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Ok,
So I've gone with Chewy's suggestion of 1 tsp of each of Julians recommended spice, not forgetting the methi (fenugreek) powder. I also add 1 tsp of Tandoori masala (nacto)
The colour doesn't look great at the moment but I've got the pan back on, and bringing it to the boil. I'll then reduce the heat to as low as possible and continue until I get the oil seperation.
Ray :)
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SHIT, just remembered, I did add 0.5 tsp of asafoteda (Hing) at the beginning and it stunk, but the smell has gone. I'll modify my first post to show this!
Ray :)
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The second boil is almost done, and as Julian said it would, the oil has come to the surface. Just to one side of the pot, there is what appears to be, an amount of 'pulp' for the want of a better term. I don't know what it is but It makes me want to remove it, as I've never seen this before.
Whilst it was boiling, there was plenty of 'foaming' going on but as Julian made no mention of removing it, I didn't either and now it has stopped.
I'm going to give it another ten mins, then let it relax.
Getting back to this pulp, I think I will pass this base through a sieve, and see what it left behind.
Ray :)
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The second boil is almost done, and as Julian said it would, the oil has come to the surface. Just to one side of the pot, there is what appears to be, an amount of 'pulp' for the want of a better term. I don't know what it is but It makes me want to remove it, as I've never seen this before.
Whilst it was boiling, there was plenty of 'foaming' going on but as Julian made no mention of removing it, I didn't either and now it has stopped.
I'm going to give it another ten mins, then let it relax.
Getting back to this pulp, I think I will pass this base through a sieve, and see what it left behind.
Ray :)
Does it taste noticeably different Ray and has a lot of oil risen to the top or the odd swirl, sometimes i don't get masses of oil separation and often wonder should i leave longer??
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SHIT, just remembered, I did add 0.5 tsp of asafoteda (Hing) at the beginning and it stunk, but the smell has gone. I'll modify my first post to show this!
Ray :)
Steady on Ray! - You will have the forum language police after you if you carry on like that ;)
Good running commentary btw!
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Hi Ray
You probably do this anyway, but I find the best thing to use, to help pass the base through a sieve (I use a Stainless one) is the bottom of a ladle.
Makes it really quick and easy.
Martin
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Does it taste noticeably different Ray and has a lot of oil risen to the top or the odd swirl, sometimes i don't get masses of oil separation and often wonder should i leave longer??
To be honest Wayne, I've kind of followed your lead on this, and resisted tasting it as of yet.
Yes, there is a lot of oil seperation on the top, and as the pot is now relaxing, the oil has virtually covered the whole surface. I'm noticing a kind of 'film' covering the oil, a bit like a very thin skin?
The colour is now pretty much as you would expect and I'm glad that I resisted the temptation to add more spices to compensate.
Steady on Ray! - You will have the forum language police after you if you carry on like that ;)
Good running commentary btw!
Hey Russ, good to hear from you again mate. Well, I hope it is all worth it. As for the bad language, yep, apologies if I've offended anyone but I'm sure it will be fine in this instance ;)
Hi Ray
You probably do this anyway, but I find the best thing to use, to help pass the base through a sieve (I use a Stainless one) is the bottom of a ladle.
Makes it really quick and easy.
Martin
I've got two options Martin, either pass it through my food mill, or go with the ladle and sieve. I think I will opt for the latter, as they are already out on my work surface.
Ray :)
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Can't wait for the next instalment Ray. Are you planning on making a curry with it tonight?
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Ok, the base is done.
I've ended up with 6.5L of sauce after sieving.
Like I said I would, I sieved the base and removed 8 level tbs, (120ml) of fibrous matter, measured with my measuring spoons. I tasted the gunk, and it was well rank :o
The taste of the actual base is quite sweet but not as sweet as I expected, however, it is quite savoury. I'm thinking that this could be down to the knorr stock pot that I put in at the start and I'm beginning to wish that I hadn't included it. Not because it has spoilt the taste but because it is no longer suitable for vegetarians, and a bonafide BIR gravy should be and that it what we should be trying to create..!
It doesn't taste much like curry as such, and hasn't got any noticeable level of heat, which should make it versatile for mild dishes. There is however, a very noticeable onion/garlic flavour to it, which you would expect. Maybe the hing has helped bring this flavour to the front. Again, I wished that I hadn't have included it now because I should have let the onions speak for themselves, and now I don't know if they have? :-\
Texture; it is very smooth and runny. Obviously, the sieving has contributed to this. If anybody has seen Chewys 3 hr base video, the gravy just runs off the spoon, leaving it very clean, this gravy behaves in the exact same way.
It has been about 10 minutes since I tasted the base and as I sit here typing, the taste is still with me. If you could imagine keeping your mouth closed, opening your jaw, then force the air in your mouth out, through your nose, that's what I'm doing now (wife looking at me like I've totally lost it :-\ ) and I'm getting that familiar, albeit subtle BIR aroma, which is encouraging.
Can't wait for the next instalment Ray. Are you planning on making a curry with it tonight?
Is the pope a Catholic? Hell yes I am lol ;D But, with all these gravy shenanigans going on, I've not prepared any chicken :(
I just need to point out, this base is NOT Julians Curry2go base but an experimental base using his method.
Ray :)
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Keep it up Ray, its like watching corrie!! LOL ;D ;D
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Keep it up Ray, its like watching corrie!! LOL ;D ;D
He he, I wish I could add sound effects, the Eastenders 'dum dum dum da dum' drum role would be very apt ;D
Ray :)
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and not a tram in sight!!!!
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Well, here's the verdict.!
So, after a day's experimenting with this base, and again, I stress that it's NOT the c2go base but a variation of it, I made a good old Chicken tikka madras.
Once the first ladle of base sauce went in, I couldn't believe how quickly it reduced down. It virtually just turned to oil within minutes. I quickly added my next ladle (about 100ml) and this time, it mixed well with all the other ingredients. Heat on high, with lid on, I carried on cooking the sauce.
I got this to reduce to about half again, then added a further 100ml of the base. The smell was great but I was also worried about, spice overload.
I gave it another minute or so, then knocked off the heat.
Whilst the sauce was relaxing, I grilled a batch of blades chicken tikka (I'd forgotten how good this is). Whilst the chicken was under the grill, I stepped outside to regain my sense of smell. If anybody could have seen me, they would have phoned the funny farm. I was breathing in and out of my nose like a raging bull on heat :o
Anyhoo, the tikka was done. I put the sauce back on a low light, just to heat it through, and added the tikka. I took it off immediately, and served on a bed of plain boiled basmati rice.
The reason I didn't give the chicken any further cooking in the sauce was because I didn't want ANY other flavours permeating the sauce.
On my first taste, my initial thought was that it wasn't as sweet as I'd hoped it would be. However, after a couple of mouthfulls, I no longer thought that, as there was a lovely sweetness coming through after each swallow. Then, the heat took over from the madras and it almost obstructed what it was that I was looking for. Luckily, I could still appreciate the sauce for what it was.
I guess my final thoughts with regards to this base is, It's not a break through in terms of "it stands out from any other base that you could possibly try" but it is a good base. The taste of the final dish was almost identical to what I usually make using Chewy's base and my spice mix, which unfortunately, throws up more questions than answers. Is my spice mix too powerful to be able to pick out other flavours individually? Is the base gravy all that important as long as it has the key ingredients, onions, garlic, ginger and minimal spices?
I suppose that the next test would be to try this base with a milder dish or even a simpler mixed powder?
The real acid test would be to make the c2g base to exact spec, including the seasoned oil?
Overall, a very usable base, very easy to make, no major break through I'm afraid, well not as yet.
I'm going to have another go tomorrow, after the base has matured for a day and my senses have returned to normal, and perhaps do a basic curry?
Many thanks for sticking with me on this one, I only wished that I could have brought you something more encouraging.
Ray :)
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Well, here's the verdict.!
So, after a day's experimenting with this base, and again, I stress that it's NOT the c2go base but a variation of it, I made a good old Chicken tikka madras.
Once the first ladle of base sauce went in, I couldn't believe how quickly it reduced down. It virtually just turned to oil within minutes. I quickly added my next ladle (about 100ml) and this time, it mixed well with all the other ingredients. Heat on high, with lid on, I carried on cooking the sauce.
I got this to reduce to about half again, then added a further 100ml of the base. The smell was great but I was also worried about, spice overload.
I gave it another minute or so, then knocked off the heat.
Whilst the sauce was relaxing, I grilled a batch of blades chicken tikka (I'd forgotten how good this is). Whilst the chicken was under the grill, I stepped outside to regain my sense of smell. If anybody could have seen me, they would have phoned the funny farm. I was breathing in and out of my nose like a raging bull on heat :o
Anyhoo, the tikka was done. I put the sauce back on a low light, just to heat it through, and added the tikka. I took it off immediately, and served on a bed of plain boiled basmati rice.
The reason I didn't give the chicken any further cooking in the sauce was because I didn't want ANY other flavours permeating the sauce.
On my first taste, my initial thought was that it wasn't as sweet as I'd hoped it would be. However, after a couple of mouthfulls, I no longer thought that, as there was a lovely sweetness coming through after each swallow. Then, the heat took over from the madras and it almost obstructed what it was that I was looking for. Luckily, I could still appreciate the sauce for what it was.
I guess my final thoughts with regards to this base is, It's not a break through in terms of "it stands out from any other base that you could possibly try" but it is a good base. The taste of the final dish was almost identical to what I usually make using Chewy's base and my spice mix, which unfortunately, throws up more questions than answers. Is my spice mix too powerful to be able to pick out other flavours individually? Is the base gravy all that important as long as it has the key ingredients, onions, garlic, ginger and minimal spices?
I suppose that the next test would be to try this base with a milder dish or even a simpler mixed powder?
The real acid test would be to make the c2g base to exact spec, including the seasoned oil?
Overall, a very usable base, very easy to make, no major break through I'm afraid, well not as yet.
I'm going to have another go tomorrow, after the base has matured for a day and my senses have returned to normal, and perhaps do a basic curry?
Many thanks for sticking with me on this one, I only wished that I could have brought you something more encouraging.
Ray :)
I think that is true Ray,doesn't seem to matter that much what you put in a base as long as you have Onions :D
well done for all your efforts ;)
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This is the reason why I look in here...good stuff!