Curry Recipes Online
Curry Base Recipes => Curry Base Chat => Topic started by: Razor on November 23, 2010, 08:01 PM
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Ok, so one or two of you may recall me making reference to me toying with the idea of a base "paste"?
Now, I'm not going to post a recipe here at the moment because it is still a work in progress but I thought I'd share with you my progress so far.
Just to give a background. The idea came from having a bit of a row with the much better half. She was livid that I had filled up the whole bottom compartment of the freezer with my base sauce (just made the 14 litre version) and to use the very articulate words of Shaun Ryder I "kettled er swede" or, done her head in, for those not familiar with Mancunian slang, lol.
Now, as much as I love making curries, I've got to admit, I don't always enjoy making all the precooked stuff, especially the base :o It proper pecks mi yed in(more Manc slang). The storing of it alone, can be a nightmare! So, I thought of the idea of creating a base, that is so concentrated in flavour, I could get away with using very little of it, and increase the liquid volume at dish stage by simply adding water.
So, this weekend gone, I made a very loose version of Panpots Ashoka bunjarra, not quite sticking to the quantities as such but mostly followed the method. At the end, I took out the cinnamon stick and bay leaf, and gave it a good blitzing in the food processor (not part of the original method).
Giving the bunjarra a little taste, I thought 'wow, that's quite strong!' Very oniony, as you would expect, very savoury, quite sweet and a wonderful after taste, infact, every element that I look for in a BIR curry!
Tonight, I thought I would give this bunjarra a bit of a "prototype" status, and try it out as a starting point for my experiment. I made my standard Chicken Jal Frezi, using precooked peppers and onions. At the stage whereby I usually add the first 100ml of my base, I added 1 heaped chef's spoon of the bunjarra (4 tbsp) and 100ml of hot water. I gave this a good stir to mix the paste and water, and then proceeded with the next 100ml followed by the last 100ml of water. I cooked this off until I had my desired consistency.
I can, hand on heart, tell you, that it was wonderful, really really surprised how well it turned out. My only gripe, not enough salt easily sorted though.
This has confirmed to me that, I can create a paste, that will give me the exact same result as using my base with the added bonus of not gettin it in the neck of Mrs Razor for robbin all the freezer space. ;D
Phase 2 will be, cooking my next batch of base using absolutely no water whatsoever but slowly frying everything until soft, then blitzing. I will keep all the other ingredients exactly the same but I will not apply the "two pan" technique as I know for sure that It won't be necessary.
Hopefully, I will post back at the weekend with a full recipe including step by step pictures, as done in my original base recipe.
Any hints, tips or advice at this stage, would be truly welcomed.
Ray :)
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Hi Razor
TBH, I think you have only come up with this new idea to 'skive off' finishing the group onion bhaji tests ;)
Jesting aside, your new project sounds fantastic to say the least! - please keep us posted. Have you got any pictures of your efforts so far?
Cheers
SP
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Hi SP,
Hi Razor
TBH, I think you have only come up with this new idea to 'skive off' finishing the group onion bhaji tests ;)
Hahaha, the thought did cross my mind too lol ;D
Jesting aside, your new project sounds fantastic to say the least! - please keep us posted. Have you got any pictures of your efforts so far?
Unfortunately not, the young un, has had the batteries out of my camera for his Xbox >:(
but in all honesty, there's very little to show in terms of a visual difference. It looks the part and tastes the part.
One thing that I would say, the house smells very good indeed. Even nicer than when I cook my standard curries? which can only be good, I think lol.
Ray :)
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originally by Razor....or Bez as he was formerly known, before he did a runner :P
robbin all the freezer space.
typical Manc.....tek the teeth out yer 'ead if they could ::) ;D
Keep us posted, Bezzer....I find your base hard to beat at the mo so if you can top it, please do lol
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Hi Domi
typical Manc.....tek the teeth out yer 'ead if they could ::) ;D
Talkin of teef, have you seen Shaun Ryders new railings? top one or wot? haha
I find your base hard to beat at the mo so if you can top it, please do lol
I'd just be chuffed if I could equal it to be honest. My thinking behind it is, It should reduce the cooking time dramatically, it will certainly save on freezer space and it may just make it that bit more savoury as it is all fried and not boiled.
Ray ;)
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well pleased for you ray. :)
is this just for space saving or are you also trying to create a better base?
sounds like you are well pleased with your first try mate. ;D
I know you like to perfect your methods before releasing them.
but if you ever want a second opinion as always i will give it a try.
Al ;D
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Hi Al,
I'm not really trying to create a better base as such but maybe the benefits of using a concentrated paste could improve the overall flavour?
It is purely a space saving exercise without compromising on taste.
I'm guessing that, those plastic takeaway tubs will hold about 3-4 chef's spoons of this paste, so if you make my "10 litre" base version, you would only need 3 of these tubs in your fridge/freezer. Massive space saving.
I've got to admit, I have really high hopes for this paste, just got to get the frying right using all my standard ingredients.
As for giving it a go Al, be my guest. All I'm going to do, is use everything that I usually do, except water but slowly fry, instead of boil. It's the method that is crucial here I think, not the ingredients.
Ray :)
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Ray,
I must admit its a great idea what you are doing.
To be honest your base doesnt see out the week at my home ;D so space saving is not an issue for me at the mo.
please keep us all updated though as i am very interested how this works out for you.
Al ;D
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It's really funny that you posted this because when I used your recipe last week, I didn't use all the water. I used less than half of what you called for. That's how thick they made it the Indian restaurants I worked for. Also, I needed to store it ... I was just going to your recipe board (Oh, I can't think of the word) - THREAD - to tell you.
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This sounds a great idea, Ray, and I look forward to hearing of further developments, but one thing slightly worries me : when you write
using absolutely no water whatsoever but slowly frying everything until soft, then blitzing
are you confident that this will be successful ? When I have tried this, I have found it necessary to add liquid to a Kenwood goblet liquidiser in order for it to be able to do its job : in the absence of additional water (or stock), things just rise up the goblet and don't get liquidised ...
** Phil.
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Great work Ray!
Its not typical BIR but surely if it gets us to more savoury BIR-like curries, then go for it.
I'm curious also what the caramelized onion of the bunjara method (when used as a base paste) would add to a curry, vs. the usual boiling method.
Very interested to see how this pans out.
Cheers,
Josh
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Good stuff Ray. I've heard of a concentrated base, with say half the water used during cooking, then more added when it is heated for the final dish. I guess your idea is the same principle but taken one step further.
Anything to cut down on the freezer space! ;D
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Hi Ray,
I do the exact thing you are toying with and it works very well. Besides taking up less room in the freezer, it will unfreeze quicker as well, and I find it actually works better in the cooking of the final dish as well compared with a frozen normal base.
I've had two different Indian Restaurant Chefs out, and both have said for freezing this is the best way, basically to get rid of as much water content as possible.
Obviously if you're going to use all the base in one go then no need to make a paste. If I'm having friends over and doing curries, I'll make the base the normal way and keep my stash in the freezer for when cooking just for the family.
To make the base gravy paste, they used 1.5kgs of onion and approx 500ml water. When blended it is very thick, and when it cools is even thicker. Oil in the pot first and heated for a couple of mins, then onion in and stirred through for a few mins, then in went the water, lid on and cooked for about 30-40 mins stirring occaisionly. When the onions were half way done at this point, in went the ginger and garlic, stirred through and then cooked another few mins. A little water was then added along with the spices and tomatoes, lid back on for another 20-30 mins. Freeze it in 4 tbsp amounts and that works well with about 250ml of water being added in the final dish.
I also do this with a korma base paste and butter base paste as well and it is superb.
When I'm cooking with the base pastes, I actually add water to the paste prior so that I end up with the gravy and then can add that into the dish as if it were prepared in the normal fashion.
Cheers,
Mark
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Razor,
fantastic idea. you could be selling this if it works - forget pataks hey.
can't think of anything to help but will get my thinking cap on.
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Hi Guy's,
Just noticed that I quoted my "10 litre" version in #7. What I meant was my 3 litre version (10 portions), sorry for the confusion.
are you confident that this will be successful ? When I have tried this, I have found it necessary to add liquid to a Kenwood goblet liquidiser in order for it to be able to do its job : in the absence of additional water (or stock), things just rise up the goblet and don't get liquidised ...
** Phil.
Hi Phil,
I don't use a jug blender, I will use my stick blender on this one. I am hopeful that it will blend ok, there is plenty of oil in there so it should be loose enough to blend ok.
I have no problem with blending my onion paste so I think/hope it will be fine.
Ray :)
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OK, good luck !
Update : tried the Bosch stick blender on my current batch of KD2 base, but on trying to get the resulting gravy through the mesh of a sieve, I realised that the particle size was still quite large. I then transferred what remained in the sieve, plus a little of the now-fltered gravy, into the goblet blender and gave it another minute, after which it seemed absolutely fine. I am not sure what the maximum run time is for a 600W stick blender, but I suspect it is considerably less than the 3 minutes that Kenwood recommend for the goblet, and I have a feeling that it may be as little as 15 to 30 seconds.
** Phil.
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Ok Guy's,
Experiment complete. Quite interesting. I'm off to Old Trafford now, but when I get home (if I get home) I will post the results with photo's too.
Ray :)
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I'm off to Old Trafford now
Old Trafford ? I thought our team were touring in Australia (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/international/theashes/8164369/The-Ashes-2010-Australia-v-England-first-Test-day-three-tea-report.html) ?!
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Ok guy's, so the experiment is complete.
I didn't quite manage to get the "paste" consistency that I would have liked however, I did manage to get it to a puree of thick yogurt consistency.
I think I could have taken it further if I'd had used a non stick pan but unfortunately I had to call it a day at the stage that I'd reached, in fear of burning the contents.
Now, unlike the water version of this base, it did require a fair bit of attention, again not helped by the use of a normal pan. It was a little labour intensive but nothing to difficult.
Here is a few photo's of how I progressed. Please excuse the picture quality, I'm obviously a better cook than I am a photographer. I will post the exact amounts and measures in the relevant section on the forum. This is just a pictorial for you all, to get better understanding of what unfolded
Ingredients:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/d301701da0ce59c232fdee4fd5908c18.JPG)
Onions, coriander, garlic and ginger frying in the oil:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/acae67b478b12ea57b1e453a611314d1.JPG)
After 10 minutes of frying on high flame:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/950d0ee6ba706a667b8b68747d5a49a0.JPG)
Salt and Spices in:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/7d57b749b3dad7f11916d7dbe25368ec.JPG)
Tomatoes in, and a can full of hot water:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/f2f64a23b38d5f2fbfad504d053e7109.JPG)
Everything completely fried off:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/ea4b2bf76747e936035f1e169ca06d99.JPG)
Ingredients pureed, note how thick it is:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/e0fc25ed31287f6973b9a86a914ac857.JPG)
And finally, how much I ended up with.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/c676ef7484742807c33200f3c634f4ff.JPG)
I ended up with 1.2 litres of base puree, which coincidentally weighed 1.2 kg, (See Phil, this metric thingy is quite simple, isn't it? :P)
Now this has been taken from my 10 portion base (3 litre) so you would need about 120ml of this puree and 180ml of water to give you 300ml of base. Now, you could either add this puree to the water and mix before hand, or, just do what I did, and added it to the pan.
Here's a few more pictures of the final curries that I made using this puree. Again, sorry for the picture quality :(
Chicken Jal Frezi
Ingredients: Front row; Oil, G/G paste, Spices, Onion Paste, Base Puree,
Back row; Water, Par boiled peppers and onions, precooked chicken, Tomatoes and chillies.
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/928321fb6c64ce1cbd6685e08163a5c1.JPG)
Garlic and Ginger frying off:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/8d2936ff2cb3170d410f714a0589182d.JPG)
Spices in, off the heat:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/f2a9a88349a4d2727b7c81ccfbc3703c.JPG)
Onion paste in:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/af6244cd6715a233249a3d4e1411f58b.JPG)
Base Puree in:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/26b1fee87f95e69f9b111416811b233b.JPG)
Water in:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/ee79b80919647784a0610de176fab8d8.JPG)
Peppers and Onions in:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/8597a7325c8d290b486c00c4d412f921.JPG)
Chicken In:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/3062a77d5b755ec183678db5e344faae.JPG)
Fresh coriander in, at the end:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/28dc7da3f641c779f871be3dded80b32.JPG)
Finished Chicken Jal Frezi:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/267fb4077c17b3d73022b53a3d5bd972.JPG)
The verdict, well, it took my by surprise a little. It tasted different to that of my normal curries using my standard base recipe. Very savoury, which for me is a good thing. Came out slightly thicker than my usual too. I suppose I could adjust the amount of water that I put in of the amount of base puree.
Did I like it? Yes, I loved it, was really good (but I would say that, wouldn't I?) ;D
Up next was the wife's veg bhuna. Now she had no idea what I was doing all day in the kitchen, so she would be perfect to judge. On her first mouthful, she looked at me and went mmmm. She then asked if I'd used another recipe? When I told her what I'd done, she immediately asked, "does that mean I get my freezer back then?"
Finally, I thought I'd give a milder curry a go with it. Not really my thing but Chicken Korma seemed the obvious one. So I knocked this one up for the lad, who in his typical teenage manner, ate it, and grunted something which I believe was "That was orrite that"
Veggie Bhuna:
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/84029905cf361527bbafa6727d9a3604.JPG)
Chicken Korma (bit too much sauce I think):
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/2ca6edb68d6b60b88d73ad415ef8eeee.JPG)
So, it seems to have past the test.
Would I use it going forward?, yes no problem!
Is It BIR?, most certainly not!
Does it give BIR results? most definitely, in my opinion of course!
Will it get the wife off mi back for robbin all her freezer space? ABSOLUTELY ;D
Hope one or two of you guy's would like to give this a go in the future. It doesn't have to be my base of course, you could use what you're using now, just leave out the water.
All feedback very welcome.
Ray :)
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Hi Razor
You are doing yourself a dis-service! - the photos look great.
Most certainly will give this a try, thank you for all your efforts to post the results for the forum to enjoy.
Regards
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I ended up with 1.2 litres of base puree, which coincidentally weighed 1.2 kg, (See Phil, this metric thingy is quite simple, isn't it? :P)
Now let me see : that's 2 1/9 pints, weighing 2lb 10oz and a bit -- OK, I can visualise that :)
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Hi SP
You are doing yourself a dis-service! - the photos look great.
Yeah, some of them turned out ok but one or two of them were a bit bright. The final korma was more vibrant in colour, than the photo suggest. Also, the photo of the puree going into the pan, makes the puree look like custard :-\
Most certainly will give this a try
Regards
Please do, like I said, you can use whatever base that you want to, the principle is the same.
What I would say is, please, don't expect the missing piece of the jigsaw here, although I did really enjoy the end curry. I only come up with this to save on space in the freezer. Mrs Razor was proper on one, because she'd been shopping and couldn't fit everything in the freezer ;)
thank you for all your efforts to post the results for the forum to enjoy.
Regards
Thankyou, for taking an interest in the subject. I'm aware that maybe a few members will find it odd, that I'm moving in the opposite direction of the BIR method but the way that I see it, is, if the end result is BIR in taste, then the method is almost irrelevant.
Ray :)
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Now let me see : that's 2 1/9 pints, weighing 2lb 10oz and a bit -- OK, I can visualise that :)
;D ;D ;D Metric, it's the future ;D ;D ;D
Ray ;D
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Good work all round Ray. ;)
interested in your wifes comment asking you if it was a different recipe you used.
considering i assume the only change you made to the recipe was the more concentrated base.
i wonder why that is :-\
jalfrezi looked great mate.
my onion paste does not look as red as yours mate, am i doing something wrong?
also you went to par boiling the veg as opposed to stir fry. do you think this also makes a difference?
i am going to deffo give this a try.
Alan ;D
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Hi Alan,
interested in your wifes comment asking you if it was a different recipe you used.
i wonder why that is
True, the only thing left out of the ingredients was the water but that meant longer frying. I'm guessing that this will make a big difference to the taste. It should do if you think about it, boiled onions v fried onions, for me, fried everytime :)
my onion paste does not look as red as yours mate, am i doing something wrong?
No, don't worry, this is not MY onion paste but a very loose version of Panpot's Ashoka Bunjarra, made with this experiment in mind. I also used the Ashoka G/G paste with this one as well.
also you went to par boiling the veg as opposed to stir fry. do you think this also makes a difference?
No, I don't think it makes much difference to the flavour in this case. I only par boiled them for about 3 mins, just to take the crunch out of them.
i am going to deffo give this a try.
Great, would love to see how you get on mate.
Ray :)
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It just occurred to me that this must have been tried before, so I did a web search for "Curry gravy concentrate", and WallysDeli.co.uk (http://www.wallysdeli.co.uk/shop/agora.cgi?cart_id=681485.29598*qs0aH7&next=40&product=CURRY--PASTES) list at least four :
- Madras Curry Paste Concentrate-405g
- Malaysian Curry Concentrate - 405g
- Vindaloo Curry Concentrate - 405g
- East & West Curry Concentrate- 405g
of which the Madras & Vindaloo may be relevant. Has anyone tried any of these ?
** Phil.
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Hi Phil,
No, never tried them before but it does suggest that these pastes are to make the final curry rather than a base but yeah, the concept is still the same.
Ray :)
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I ended up with 1.2 litres of base puree, which coincidentally weighed 1.2 kg, (See Phil, this metric thingy is quite simple, isn't it? :P)
Now let me see : that's 2 1/9 pints, weighing 2lb 10oz and a bit -- OK, I can visualise that :)
Not that it matters much, but unless the resultant paste was pure water (or was very aerated), 1.2 litres of it (or whatever alternative equivalent units you choose to use) must most definitely weigh considerably more than 1.2kg (or whatever alternative equivalent units you choose to use) :P
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Hi CA,
Well, unless my scales need calibrating, that's what it weighed.
I know where you are coming from, 400g of water, 400g of tinned toms, 1kg of onion, plus perhaps about 50g of spices, should give more weight to the end puree.
However, I reduced most of the liquid except for the oil, obviously. Plus, any water realeased from the onions was also cooked off, so in reality, the weight of the onions probably ended up being about half of their uncooked weight
Ray :)
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No, where I'm coming from is that the density of water (at STP) is 1g/cc. And the density of the other blended ingredients (oil, tomatoes, onions, spices, etc) is more than that (at least I presume that's the case!). Therefore, I assume that the density of the resultant paste must be (or should be) greater than 1g/cc? As I said, not that it matters much, but an interesting measurement nevertheless :P
Bottom line, it seems to me, is that this is like a typical "cook in sauce"....only versatile enough to allow you to add different spices, to make different dishes, at the final dish preparation stage.....besides saving on freezer space, of course :P
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The density of the other blended ingredients (oil, tomatoes, onions, spices, etc) is more than that (at least I presume that's the case!).
Ah, b u t : if oil were denser than water, it would sink when mixed with water; but it doesn't : it floats. Ergo, oil is less dense than water. Q.E.D.
:)
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I'm more interested in this comment of yours, though, Ray:
maybe a few members will find it odd, that I'm moving in the opposite direction of the BIR method but the way that I see it, is, if the end result is BIR in taste, then the method is almost irrelevant.
And I have to say that that thought definitely struck me. I think the method is most definitely relevant (irrespective of the end result) and we should always ask ourselves "what do BIRs do?"
Perhaps it's no different than freezing bases and other ingredients though? :-\ And it is often more a question of practical convenience for the home cook.
I also question how far removed things become from traditional/authentic Indian cooking? If it deviates too far from what BIRs do, then why bother (in the context of this forum at least)?
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oil is less dense than water
True, but I'd be surprised if that explains it (in light of the other stuff in there). But perhaps Ray's right.... :P
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No, where I'm coming from is that the density of water (at STP) is 1g/cc. And the density of the other blended ingredients (oil, tomatoes, onions, spices, etc) is more than that (at least I presume that's the case!). Therefore, I assume that the density of the resultant paste must be (or should be) greater than 1g/cc?
That's as maybe but what exactly are the water content of onions, tomatoes, garlic, ginger? And once the water had been released, it was mostly cooked off. At no point during the cooking of this, was a lid used, so a hell of a lot of liquid evaporated.
I do understand the science behind what your saying, 1.2 litres of most liquid, should weigh considerably more then 1.2kg, fair enough!
perhaps my scales are wrong, i'll check.
Bottom line, it seems to me, is that this is like a typical "cook in sauce"....only versatile enough to allow you to add different spices, to make different dishes, at the final dish preparation stage
That's exactly what it is
Ray :)
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I do understand the science behind what your saying, 1.2 litres of most liquid, should where considerably more then 1.2kg, fair enough!
No, you seemingly don't Ray ;D I'm saying that 1.2 "litres" of most "solids" (e.g. your paste) would weigh considerably more than 1.2kg. But, no matter, just an observation (I'd rather suggest you check your volume measurement Ray...I can see your scales!?)
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Hi CA,
And I have to say that that thought definitely struck me. I think the method is most definitely relevant (irrespective of the end result) and we should always ask ourselves "what do BIRs do?"
Fair enough but we have to be practical too. We cook in the home environment whereby space and storage is important, something that the BIR's need not worry about. As you say, freezing a base is not BIR, and yet all of us, except JerryM, freeze our base.
Most of us have no option but to use our grills or BBQ when we want tikka or tandoori, again not very BIR but, practical.
The trouble with trying to emulate BIR method is, actual accounts of BIR methods on the forum, vary too much to say "yes, that is the standard and is how we must do it to get the taste"
I make no apologies for wandering off the BIR path slightly, if I still end up with BIR results, and, if it saves me from the wrath of the much better half ;D
Ray :)
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oil is less dense than water
True, but I'd be surprised if that explains it (in light of the other stuff in there). But perhaps Ray's right.... :P
Haha, sadly, I just tested this. Onions and tomatoes (unblended) must be very close to the density of water (cos they almost float), oil is less and spices (I haven't tested this, but I assume their density) is greater. Perhaps the end result is close to the density of water afterall! Hmmm, I stand corrected! ::)
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Fair enough but we have to be practical too
I don't disagree Ray, which is why I said "and it is often more a question of practical convenience for the home cook".
However, I do still question how far we should go off the "BIR beaten track" in our efforts to be "practical"?
For instance, I'd be staggered if many BIRs fry their onions, garlic ginger, spices, etc when making their curry base. I suspect they simply lob them all into a pot and boil them.
Now, perhaps frying the onions, garlic, ginger, spices etc gives members a palletable "BIR taste" (e.g. sweetness, depth of flavour, etc) but, if that's not how BIRs do it, isn't it a bit misleading?
Surely such an approach can lead us down the "wrong" garden path and we will never reveal the true methods used by BIRs?
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I have a Great Idea [tm] : we need to interest Mr Nescaf
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you could be onto something there Phil ;D
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I suspect they simply lob them all into a pot and boil them.
In other words, KD1. Now I know that I tend to bang on about Kris Dhillon quite a bit, but as far as I am concerned, adopting her base and methodology took me from 5% to over 90% of achieving BIR results, and with the benefit of experience, this is now closer to 95%. I therefore still think that simpler is better, and although I definitely do not think that others are wasting their time in investigating more complex bases and methodologies, for myself I am very happy to stick to KD1 base and experiment only with the ingredients and methodology for the final dish.
** Phil.
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you could be onto something there Phil ;D
Provisional patent application already part-complete ;)
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I have a Great Idea [tm] : we need to interest Mr Nescaf
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In other words, KD1. Now I know that I tend to bang on about Kris Dhillon quite a bit, but as far as I am concerned, adopting her base and methodology took me from 5% to over 90% of achieving BIR results, and with the benefit of experience, this is now closer to 95%.
Yes you do Phil ;)
The trouble I have with that is that Kris's stuff never, in my opinion, got close to helping reproduce decent BIR curries at home.
I mean absolutely no disrespect to Kris (for she was one of the curry cooking pioneers/gurus bringing "BIR-like" curry cooking to the home).
Kris's book (like Pat Chapman's books) certainly was, and is, a valuable stepping stone for aspiring BIR home cooks......but it certainly isn't (and never was, in my opinion) the last word on BIR curry cooking subject, by a long chalk......
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http://worid-of-books.com/?id=mwBLAAAAYAAJ (http://worid-of-books.com/?id=mwBLAAAAYAAJ)
Putatively a download of The accelerated freeze-drying (AFD) method of food preservation by HMSO, it actually contents a trojan horse that could seriously compromise your PC.
** Phil.
Why an earth would you post a link and then tell people not to follow it or else they will get a trojan Phil?? :-\
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The trouble I have with that is that Kris's stuff never, in my opinion, got close to helping reproduce decent BIR curries at home.
OK, clearly our experiences differ. But let me make a suggestion (or ask a favour : interpret it how you will) -- using her KD1 base, try her KD1 chicken curry, but increase the volume of base by 100%, the quantity of spices per unit of base by 100%, reduce or eliminate the garam masala unless you have access to a really good one, and scale up the chilli according to her guidelines to get the sort of strength that you prefer. And then let us know what you thought of the finished dish.
** Phil.
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Why an earth would you post a link and then tell people not to follow it or else they will get a trojan Phil?? :-\
Because others, wanting to learn more about Accelerated Freeze Drying following my earlier (and not entirely frivolous) suggestion, might end up following exactly the same link that I did. Now my PC is locked down with at least three defences against Trojan horses, so it never even got off the launching pad, but others may have fewer defenses and may therefore benefit by being warned of the danger of following this apparently innocuous link. "Forewarned is forearmed", as they say.
** Phil.
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OK, clearly our experiences differ. But let me make a suggestion (or ask a favour : interpret it how you will) -- using her KD1 base, try her KD1 chicken curry, but increase.....reduce or eliminate....and scale up
All these things have been proposed, tried and tested on this forum 6, or more, years ago Phil. It's time the forum moved on, I think?........ :-\
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It's time the forum moved on, I think?........ :-\
I really don't know what to say. "Moving on", for moving on's sake, seems singularly pointless to me. If you can refer me to some earlier posts, going back siz years as you suggest, in which the majority of members at that time who tried what I have just suggested found the results wanting, then I will be more than happy to accept that my liking for KD1 base is in the minority, and keep quiet (on this topic, at least) while others "move on". I really would be grateful for such a reference.
** Phil.
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Well, I notice that you've recently posted Kris's curry base recipe....so you could start with the one previously posted, just over 5 years ago, here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=579.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=579.0)
Thereafter, you really need to do a search of the forum, there is so much stuff relating to Kris Dhillion's book and recipes (good, bad and indifferent).
By "moving on" I really meant to say "moving forward" (rather than moving in circles or, indeed, backwards)
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Always good to see ideas and enthusiastic new members being encouraged to participate in this open forum ;)
Can't for the life of me think why so many of the current members don't get involved in the friendly discussion?
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It's time the forum moved on, I think?........ :-\
Or...maybe it's time you moved on from the forum. ;)
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Not that it matters much, but unless the resultant paste was pure water (or was very aerated), 1.2 litres of it (or whatever alternative equivalent units you choose to use) must most definitely weigh considerably more than 1.2kg (or whatever alternative equivalent units you choose to use) :P
Perhaps the end result is close to the density of water afterall! Hmmm, I stand corrected!
Ah the folly of the ill informed! ;D
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Ray - how would you compare the curries between using the paste method vs using the base? Which is the tastier curry?
-- Josh
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Hi Josh,
Ray - how would you compare the curries between using the paste method vs using the base? Which is the tastier curry?
-- Josh
Well, the "base puree" produced a very nice curry indeed. It does however taste slightly different than my "water base". Don't get me wrong, it tasted really good but I think I expected it to taste pretty much the same.
I would say that it's slightly sweeter, owing to the prolonged frying of the onions, and it turns out slightly thicker, so I'd need to experiment further with the puree/water volumes in the final dish.
All in all, a very productive day for me at least, and a very comparable BIR style curry at the end of it as a bonus.
Ray :)
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Fair enough but we have to be practical too
For instance, I'd be staggered if many BIRs fry their onions, garlic ginger, spices, etc when making their curry base. I suspect they simply lob them all into a pot and boil them.
Actually, everything I have seen with my own eyes suggests this is a very BIR practice. If you look at the Dip video, he adds all the veg to the oil and effectively fries them in the stockpot only adding water later when they have reduced right down. The kitchen demo at Zaffrons showed a similar method for their main base sauce. The chef there had a massive tool that looked like a crowbar for turning the onions and green pepper in the stockpot while the 'fried' in the oil. Only once the veg release their water does it become more of a boil than fry.
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If you look at the Dip video, he adds all the veg to the oil and effectively fries them in the stockpot only adding water later when they have reduced right down.
Actually, he adds all the ingredients (minus the tomatoes and spices) and covers them with water and boils them.
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So where is this video, guys ? I have just looked at all three pages of Curry Videos (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=21.0) and none seem to be "the Dip video" to which you both refer.
** Phil.
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Here you go Phil (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4375.0) ;)
link fixed lol
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Dip's videos are in the main dishes section.
For instance: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4538.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4538.0)
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Here you go Phil (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=21.0) ;)
Er, that's where I was looking Domi : what can you see that I can't ?!
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Dip's videos are in the main dishes section.
For instance: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4538.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4538.0)
Thank you, Ramirez : all now clear.
** Phil.
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lol sorry, fixed the link now ;D
Here you go Phil (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4375.0) ;)
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lol sorry, fixed the link now ;D
Here you go Phil (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4375.0) ;)
Thank you, Domi ! (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/76bacb1f27257e604f49207d4c1ea172.jpg)
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You got any further with this, Ray, after the first attempt didn't come out how you expected? Your base has been my staple for some time now, so I am eager to see how you get on with this 'paste'.
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Hi Ramirez,
It's not so much that it didn't turn out as I expected as such, it was just much sweeter. I expected it to be exactly the same as all the ingredients are the same.
It's a little trickier to do, whereas my base is pretty simple. Is it worth doing as standard? It is if you missus is anything like mine, and stresses out at me when I rob all her freezer space lol.
If space isn't a problem, then my standard base is the easier of the two to do.
I just enjoyed doing the experiment really, it's good to get fresh ideas out in the open.
Ray :)
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I thought it wasn't as condensed as you would have liked, hence not quite the 'paste' that you were aiming for.
Freezer space is at a premium for me - I've got one of those fridge freezer with the tiny freezer compartments - not ideal for storing base, let me tell you! :)
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Hi Ram,
I thought it wasn't as condensed as you would have liked, hence not quite the 'paste' that you were aiming for.
Freezer space is at a premium for me - I've got one of those fridge freezer with the tiny freezer compartments - not ideal for storing base, let me tell you! :)
Yes, I didn't quite get it to a paste, more of a puree, still, it made a massive difference to the space required in my freezer. I haven't made my 14 litre version yet, but when I do, I usually take up ALL the bottom compartment of the freezer, and it absolutely does her swede in, I mean, she proper goes on one.
That will be the acid test I guess. Actually, thinking about it, I reckon that my bigger version will allow me to get closer to the consistency that I'm after, purely down to the larger volume of solids?
We'll see
Ray :)