Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: moonster on November 17, 2010, 09:48 PM
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Hi all,
I have just made a curry to a BIR standard no doubt, even better.
I have been using razors base for a while now with great results and go between CA's ceylon and razors Jalfrezi depending on whether i fancy a curry with veg or not.
I have just been fitting my own kitchen and invested in a hob which included a gas wok burner at 3.5 kw.
wow.
I have just made a beef ceylon based on ca's chicken ceylon using razors base.
I must stress that i made the base to spec other than adding a knorrs chicken stock to razors base when he adds the water towards the end.
used CA's method even including my precooked beef at the beginning.( which i have a class recipe for).
conclusion.
I use a cast iron wok and at that intesity of heat was amazing. as soon as i added the base the oil rose to the top straight away so had to add more straight away. so for me it is all about heat. even mrs moony (my biggest critic) said i had finally cracked it hence the title.
seriously i am well happy ;D
thanks all
Alan ;D
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Well done Alan : what more can one say ?!
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seriously i am well buzzing.
basically what i am saying is that the recipes and methods on this forum by other posters are spot on.
but with the higher heat you have to do things a lot more quickly. probably like in restraunts and takeaways and it made a real significant difference.
I could seriously knock CA's dish out in 5 to ten minutes which i did tonight.
I know i am having a eureka moment right now ;D
sad i know but i am well happy.
thanks all
Alan ;D
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originally by moonster
I have just made a beef ceylon based on ca's chicken ceylon using razors base.
I must stress that i made the base to spec other than adding a knorrs chicken stock to razors base when he adds the water towards the end.
used CA's method even including my precooked beef at the beginning.( which i have a class recipe for).
Well done moonster ;D Your post backs up my last post about tailor-making recipes to suit your own tastes. Though I hope you're not following in Archimedes footsteps and tearing down the street naked :o lol
It's always good when a plan comes together ;)
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lol domi,
you must of been watching :o
seriously though, i could not of achieved tonight ,what i did without the other posters sharing there knolwedge on this forum.
you are quite right though about adapting recipes to your own taste. personally i always make the authors curry to spec before making alterations.
high heat is the answer, trust me on this one 8)
Alan ;D
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ha ha Domi,
have just read your post on the other thread. very interesting that we both use razors base. personally i dont feel i need to explore any other base any further as his base is excellent and covers my needs, although i do add the knorrs chicken stock pot at the water stage.
my eureka moment came from replicating the recipes on this forum many times but the additional heat( halving the cooking time) has took the same recipes to a new dimension :P.
;D ;D ;D
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Hi all,
I have just made a curry to a BIR standard no doubt, even better.
I have been using razors base for a while now with great results and go between CA's ceylon and razors Jalfrezi depending on whether i fancy a curry with veg or not.
Alan ;D
Alan, could you put the links in for this, or assemble it together, in a post
Sometimes there are different versions of recipes
I want to see exactly what you did
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Hi Alan, ;D
Any chance you could post your full recipe/method? It's always good to read someone else's accounts....
I'm having my kitchen done just after Xmas and I'll be getting a range with a wok burner - can't wait! Where did you get yours from, if you don't mind me asking? I've heard very good reports from Wren kitchens and to be honest some of the larger retailers have a terrible track record if the review sites are to be believed.
Got my brother-in-law doing the fitting so that's going to save me a few grand ;D I'll let you know how I get on with the extra heat ;)
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Hi Domi,
I will attempt to get the recipe and method posted before the weekend.
Regarding your kitchen, seriously look no further than www.diy-kitchens.com (http://www.diy-kitchens.com)
I am a time served joiner and have been a site manager for the last ten years, so you can trust my judgement on this one.
you will get everything you need from this website including all your appliances. I went with the CDA range.
they delivered everything on the day and time they said, customer service was spot on and very professional, they phone you to go through your order before taking final payment to make sure you have not missed or over ordered on something.
the quality of the units are the best i have seen in all my years in the trade i am well happy with my purchase overall. ;D
the most important bit you need to know is that they are also the cheapest, ignore all the other websites offering as high as 50%discounts, this one doesnt because it cant.
when the delivery drivers delivered the kitchen i couldnt believe the quality for what i had paid.
he said they supply to some of the top showrooms in the country and they instantly add 60% on top of what i had paid. read into that what you will!!
obviously i had already done a lot of research and cost comparisons before commiting to buy from there because it is such a huge investment.
i would highly reccomend you check it out.
hope you see what you are looking for
Alan ;D
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you are not allowed to crack it ! cr0 members would have nothing to moan and rant about for one thing ! lol ;D
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Well I have either cracked it or fluked it. It is deffo one of the two though ;D
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Thanks Moonster ;) Much appreciated :)
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great post moonster, glad you have found your curry nirvana!!
your link to kitchen website seems to be a portal to a lot of other kitchen companies?
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stephen,
thanks for pointing that out.
Domi here is the correct link below
www.diy-kitchens.com (http://www.diy-kitchens.com)
Alan ;D
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Domi - lol whose writing your gags these days ! ! , ;D tee hee
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I reckon there is something in the heat theory. It certainly is true for Chinese. It also explains (but not excuses) the odd take away I have had that had burned very slightly. Maybe the chef was just striving for the super heat :o
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moonster - thanks for the link - excellent site!!
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Nice post.
Can you put some pics up, would like to see the cooker and the curries.
Stew
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Stew,
I will post pics on sunday as the next time i will be able to cook a curry is on saturday.
I have ran out of razors base :( so got to knock some up on saturday morning.
I will also attempt to link everything together of what i did.
thanks
Alan ;D
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I actually think cooking a curry should be quick and very very hot. if you cook to long at high heat you go past a point of no return where things like spice and garlic and tom puree begin to decline in flavour. this is how they cook at my local bir, very high heat and short cooking time. I know the slow boat method is also good sometimes, but generally i adopt a quick high temp cooking phase.
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moonster,
well pleased for you. i was at my local TA last night and must admit the only thing that really caught me eye (well always does) is the chefs burner.
not being negative in anyway but i'm surprised that 3.5kw does it. my stove was initially 2.5kw. i then switched hob to gas which is 3.0kw. neither did it. my stove at max is ~9kw but i don't have it at full wack - i'd say pretty close though - say something like 7kw. i do turn the heat down for CTM and the like but it's impossible to tell to what kw value.
do you get a lot of smoke and mess - i've had to move cooking into the garage.
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Hi jerry,
9kw wow. wouldnt want to pay your gas bill ;D
i have went from a conventional cooker to what now seems like a beast in comparison to what i have had before.
i also mentioned i use a cast iron wok which retains the heat like nothing i have used before so could be a combination of both.
it does spit up the sides but because its a deep wok i get very little mess onto the hob. (mrs moony may disagree with the previous comment though ;D).
regards
Alan ;D
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I'm sorry but I am not convniced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good) how many reciopes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why?
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Moonster great post and although Jerry sets the standard with his fantastic burner and great method you will get very good results with what you are doing. Heat is vital and curry is cooked very quickly both in TAs and BIRs. Seperatly I can't thank you enough for the kitchen site. I am moving to Canterbury in January and we are considering a new kitchen so your advice is invaluable. Can you share the cooker you have chosen and any further advise about taken advantage of the sites prices and quality when like me I am hopeless at DIY. If anyone else in the aera can recommend a fitter that would be cool. Thanks PP
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This is taken from http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2815.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=2815.0)
This from the man himself and he talks about high temperature.
Sorry i don't know ho to do on here but by the magic of copy and paste
some of what he wrote is below...
Phil, Chaa006 thank you very much for the info you sent me :) I can now do "quotes"
As you know I have been in discussion with Bruce Edwards and he has kindly provided CR0.co.uk with an article on the restaurant Curry Sauce and Basic Curry. So here it is.......
Bruce Edwards
I discovered this forum about a year after it first came online, and have visited it from time to time since then. Initially progress seemed slow, then people started reporting on kitchen demos, and things started to get interesting. Very soon there was some good information, but also a lot that wasn't helpful, and some - well I wont say any more. The difficulty for many people was just what to believe Common problems are that when someone sees for the first time what goes on in a restaurant kitchen they're are in an unfamiliar environment, their observations are often unreliable and they often misinterpret what they have seen. They might see a pan on the cooker on a burner that resembles a rocket engine and so conclude that a high temperature and lots of heat are necessary, but they fail to notice that the contents of the pan are only simmering, because it is a small pan and most of the heat is going up the side. The chef then takes the opportunity to impress the visitor by producing a sheet of flame with a flick of his spoon and a shake of the pan, and the impression is reinforced.
Another example is quantities; the visitor sees a massive pot of sauce on the cooker and asks how much coriander/turmeric/cumin etc. he needs in his pot which is 'this' big. The chef, trying to be helpful, makes a guess. Now think about it. If your pot is 6 inches in diameter and the same in depth, and the restaurant one is three times this, [distinctly possible] then the restaurant one actually contains TWENTY SEVEN times the volume of yours, as simple arithmetic will show, but a fact that might easily be overlooked.
People look for recipes with a definite result in mind. And while recipes are obviously important and have a part to play, what BIR cooking is really all about is using Traditional Indian methods and spices to cook dishes that are not typically 'Indian'.
When everything is right, the Restaurant Flavour/Smell is produced, almost as a by-product of the process as a whole. Of course the chef will have heard of this, but probably wont be too clear about what we actually mean by it. He will almost certainly assume that we are talking about general spiciness. Only a true British Curry Enthusiast can fully appreciate it.
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pp,
I went with the CDA range on cooker, hob,extractor, fridge, freezer and sink and taps. i went with the silver five burner hob at ?191 and the 8 function oven. (and they offer 10% discount on all appliances).
advice would be to go for the high range doors as the difference in price between the low range and the high range for example would cost an extra ?300 for a kitchen containing 20 doors.
regardless of what kitchen you order the quality of the carcasses will always be the same.
cheekily go for the one man delivery at ?75 like i did. two men turn up anyway ;D.
I also agree with graeme in that ultimate heat is not the answer and that is not what i am trying to say because i dont even use my wok burner to full capacity.
I do believe however that since i have used the wok burner that my results have significantly produced better results than my favourate restraunt.
I also must point out that i am not saying i have cracked it for everyone on this forum and that i have only cracked it for ourselves as we have far surpassed what we have achieved before.
I have got to say though that out of everything i have tried for the past 10-15 years (believe me i have tried everything :'() my eureka moment came from replicating the excellent recipes on this forum as i have done so many times but this time at the higher intensity heat and also halving the cooking time has had the single biggest impact on achieving what i percieve as a BIR curry.
hope my feedback helps
Alan ;D
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I'm sorry but I am not convinced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good) how many recipes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why?
ThaiExpat,
what you say is exactly right. i cook the curry in 5 mins on full right through (something like 30 sec g/g, 60 sec spices). with this heat the skill is in the early stages in not overcooking or burning. i don't see any difference in taste upto the end of the spice stage. i don't know enough about why the heat works but gut feeling is that the heat is not needed at the g/g and spice stages. for me i see the difference between low say 3 kw and high say 7 kw when the 1st chef spoon goes into the spices. i think water "thin" base is also a factor and believe the oil and water burns somehow.
this is the link to my exploits http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0). i've now had something like 12 mths of further practise cooking in the garage - since my last post and feel very comfortable and happy.
clearly it's not for everyone - believe me if you can cook in your kitchen then you are not cooking at the same temperature as i do. watch the extract in your local TA.
moonster,
i am working on pizza at the moment and the idea of a heat mass "pizza stone" has cropped up there. i'm hopefully trying out today myself. in terms of curry i can see it working in this application too and making the difference you report. best wishes.
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I'm sorry but I am not convinced with this extra heat theory, my cooker here (Thailand) has a main double deep burner ring(same takeaway) and I have tried the high heat theory before ,don't even try ginger and garlic as it burns in an instant as well, as many other ingredients, yes it might work if you cook on medium in the first two mins and throw the base in (sounds good) how many recipes on this forum though say cook 4 mins , 8 mins or longer after adding ginger and garlic and adding base one spoon at a time, it won't work, it takes too long for a takeaway, but members rave on about their recipes using this method, why?
ThaiExpat,
what you say is exactly right. i cook the curry in 5 mins on full right through (something like 30 sec g/g, 60 sec spices). with this heat the skill is in the early stages in not overcooking or burning. i don't see any difference in taste upto the end of the spice stage. i don't know enough about why the heat works but gut feeling is that the heat is not needed at the g/g and spice stages. for me i see the difference between low say 3 kw and high say 7 kw when the 1st chef spoon goes into the spices. i think water "thin" base is also a factor and believe the oil and water burns somehow.
this is the link to my exploits http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1851.0). i've now had something like 12 mths of further practise cooking in the garage - since my last post and feel very comfortable and happy.
clearly it's not for everyone - believe me if you can cook in your kitchen then you are not cooking at the same temperature as i do. watch the extract in your local TA.
moonster,
i am working on pizza at the moment and the idea of a heat mass "pizza stone" has cropped up there. i'm hopefully trying out today myself. in terms of curry i can see it working in this application too and making the difference you report. best wishes.
JerryM ,
Interesting post , I know you have been a fan of ' High temperature cooking ' and your mention of the difference in taste seems to be once the first spoon of Base goes in had me thinking back to my comments on your Madras post.
What if the spoon of Base you are adding which is basically liquidized boiled Onions are then subjected to extreme heat would fry / caramalize the Onion in the Base to give this ' special ' flavour that moonster has found and maybe the missing 5% we are missing :o
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eminj,
I think you have hit the nail firmly on the head mate, thanks for working that out for me. ;D
I just put it down to the extra heat without thinking why.
when i look back there was definatley caramalisation going on when i added the base, that is why i had to keep adding the base continuously rather than waiting for the oil to rise to the surface.
thanks
Alan ;D
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You don't need high heat to make a BIR curry
I've seen them prepared with high heat, and low heat
It doesn't affect the outcome
I thought it did, that's why I bought a BIR catering cooker
Believe me, it made no difference
It just gives speed and the ability to incinerate everything
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You don't need high heat to make a BIR curry
I've seen them prepared with high heat, and low heat
It doesn't affect the outcome
I thought it did, that's why I bought a BIR catering cooker
Believe me, it made no difference
It just gives speed and the ability to incinerate everything
Back to the drawing board then ??? ;)
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looks that way :(
looking back the extra heat/caramelisation really didnt really make a difference, it must of been the five cans of lager before hand that must of altered my taste buds to believe i replicated a BIR dish. ;D
either way at least i know what to do if its not the extra heat it is definatly the lager ;D
happy days
Alan ;D
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looks that way :(
looking back the extra heat/caramelisation really didnt really make a difference, it must of been the five cans of lager before hand that must of altered my taste buds to believe i replicated a BIR dish. ;D
either way at least i know what to do if its not the extra heat it is definatly the lager ;D
happy days
Moonster........you have sorted the whole BIR taste thing for me..............when most people (well some) go for curry they are pretty well pi$$ed. That's all I need to do. The pressure is off now ;D ;D
Alan ;D
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;D trucker,
thats been the answer all along ;D
i cant believe i have wasted the best part of my life trying to replicate a BIR at home, just get pissed and they all taste good ;D ;D
thanks
Alan ;D
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emin-j,
i can't work out what it is that happens with the extra heat. all i can add is that if there is no smoke then i don't get the different taste. when i get a lot of smoke i get the taste difference.
Haldi,
all i can add is that i have really tried to get the same result with low heat and failed.
the big burner does for sure give the speed and ability to incinerate everything. it took me quite a while to master it - in fact it needed real perseverance to find the difference (read the link in the earlier post).
cooking in the garage is quite a hassle (the trip round the house with a tray of ingredients etc) but honestly i won't be moving the cooking back to low heat.
et al,
it's not worth going round the discussion on this one. you need to make up your own mind on whether it's worth it to you. all i can say is the stove at ?30 is the best thing i've bought in probably my life. look at the extract in your TA - if there is no smoke going up the stack then stick with what you use at the moment.
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Can you tell us more about this stove at GBP 30-00, Jerry; that is what I paid for an induction hob that puts out 2Kw max :-(((
** Phil.
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Jerry,
excellent link on page 3. I would urge anyone reading this thread to open Jerrys link.
personally i am finding it very interesting reading a lot of what has been discussed on there and it is ringing very true for me.
regards
Alan ;D
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Phil,
parker21 put me onto it. i bought the 2.5 kw version. then drilled out the jet slightly to up the heat to 8.8kw (the bigger jet can be purchased).
i run it on a 12kg propane (lasts ages).
you can't use it in your kitchen though. i did for a while before i upped the jet. you get oil vapour settling and lots of splashes on the floor. i did use newspaper which works for the splashes but the oil vapour settles on everything.
a shed or garage is what's needed to go with the stove.
link http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4309.msg39517#msg39517 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=4309.msg39517#msg39517)
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Ah yes, just the thing. And as my wife is Vietnamese/Chinese, she'll be all in favour so that she can cook her favourite stir-fries at the proper temperature :-) Now all we have to do is decide where to put it !
** Phil.
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Now all we have to do is decide where to put it !
Not that easy - I put it on a bench underneath the ceiling electric light by mistake not realising the extent of the heat and potential flames. i've now moved it to the side.
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Phil,
sometimes pic better than words
(http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/pics/1e79c72399f586356c75671d238c2beb.jpg) (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/imagehost/#1e79c72399f586356c75671d238c2beb.jpg)
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Ah ... !
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ooo :o
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Jerry, you are an absolute legend. Industrial type results without the necessary industrial extractor hood. What a mess no wonder you are out there in the garage my wife would have an almighty fit. Your neighbours must either love or otherwise the smell emanating from your abode. Nice one. PP
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Your neighbours must either love or otherwise the smell emanating from your abode.
Panpot,
got me chuckling. the next door don't like curry but before knowing what i was cooking had commented on how good the smell was. the rest must think i'm potty. the smell lasts for about 3 days and everytime i open the door - heaven.
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ooo :o
Seconded!
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Well done Moonster!!
All along I think each person has their own ideas and personal tastes for what they are looking for in their BIR's. Regional differences in restaurants account for a lot of this I believe.
For me at any rate... On the assumption that you have a good base & fresh ingredients without doubt the heat & the speed of cooking is the key to getting that taste...
Haha What goes around comes around...see link below from 2006
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1104.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1104.0)
Cheers