Curry Recipes Online
Beginners Guide => Trainee Chefs / Beginners Questions => Topic started by: Razor on October 12, 2009, 02:45 PM
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Hello guys,
Can anyone tell me, is there is a difference between a Balti and a BIR. Reading a post earlier, it seems that I may have wrongly assumed that they are one of the same thing? I always thought that the difference was that a Balti was cooked in a Balti wok or a Karahi, where as a BIR was cooked in a pan? I am currently using the "Authentic Balti Curry" book written by Mohammed Ali Haydor & Andy Holmes and the results that I am getting are unbelievable, better than most BIR's that I have been in. By the way, this site is truly fantastic and by far the most informative that I have been on so far.
Thankyou all very much.
Ray
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Hi Razor,
A Balti is a type of curry, BIR stands for British Indian Restaurant. I think you might have got your wires crossed a bit.
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Hi CHris,
Yeah, I knew that BIR was the abbreviation but it was a post that I read earlier whereby somebody was talking about a balti and they got a reply of "don't mistake a balti with a BIR"? This made me wonder was they infact different. Take for instance, in the book that I have mentioned, there is a recipe for 'Balti Chicken Tikka Masala'. What I am asking is, does this differ in any way to a standard 'Chicken Tikka Masala'? Up until now I always thought that there was no difference and it was just a term of phrase but now, Im not so sure? The one thing that I would say about the recipies that I have tried from the book, is that they appear to be slightly thicker in consistancy than most restaurants (which is to my preference)
Thanks again Chris
Ray
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Hi Ray,
This question was also debated a little here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1764.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=1764.0)
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Razor,
they are quite different. the trouble is there are lots of restaurants/TA who have claimed allegiance and added Balti into there shop name and menu. one of my fav local restaurants calls itself balti - it ain't it's quite clearly BIR.
the home of balti is in brum on alum rock road. very few BIR's do balti quite the same. decent imitation yes.
i don't believe there is a difference in the way it is cooked only that balti should be served in a metal bowl that has been pre heated to a v.hot temp. the nearest BIR curry to balti is Korahi.
it's the spices for me that are different.
i would say for me i prefer BIR to balti. i start to struggle with some of the recipes in balti as they favour vegetables which i'm only ok on upto a point.
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Just to show the (surprisingly wide) range of balti experiences out there.... the couple of times I ordered Balti, it was nothing more than a Bhuna-ish dry curry served on a karahi.
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I'm still not clear what the difference between a Balti and a more traditional BIR curry really is.
It seems to me that Baltis (besides being a bit of a marketing gimmick) are more so stir fried, use fresher ingredients (e.g. fresh herbs) and are possibly more aromatic (e.g. using garam masala) than traditional BIR curries. And with probably more creative "mix and match" dishes.
Otherwise they are typically served in a balti bowl, with naan bread instead of rice, in a cheap truck-stop style restaurant (with plastic table clothes and chairs to boot). At least this was originally the case.
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it's the spices for me that are different.
How would you say they differ please Jerry?
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CA,
u're description of balti sits well with me. the plastic table cloth is a must for the place to be the real deal.
the balti spice seems more full on - i guess further towards authentic. this i would say is why i don't like balti as much as BIR which has subtle spicing for me. it's the stir fry element that makes balti "balti" for me.
i have Lynette Baxter's balti book. i use the spice mix and the base is pretty good. i tried the chicken balti but tasted well short of the real thing. there are a lot of recipes in the book but they're just not my type of dish eg, black eyed bean, spinach & mushroom balti. for some they're probably great - they just don't switch my light on. the dreaded garam masala does appear in most dishes (to my despair).
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Wow, thanks for the reply guys and thanks for the link CA. Im still not 100% clear but I tend to agree with Jerry as regards to the spice blends. Most of the recipes that I have seen on here tend not to include garam masala whereby the recipes that I have do as it makes up part of what they call the 'base spice'. Also, the 'base sauce' or curry gravy if you prefer has quite a lot of ingredients in it like, mace, cassia bark, cloves, green cardamom, star anise, bay leaf and your usual veg, carrots onions, red & green peppers. In making this, you have to cook a tomato mixture seperatley which I believe is called a 'tarka' Once both are cooked, you simply mix them together and wizz it up, and you have your base.
The one thing that I would say, is that every recipe that I have tride from the book looks very similar in colour which I am sure is down to the base sauce. The consistancy is also very similar, again I belive this to be down to the base, as it is quite thick. In my experience, most curries differ in colour slightly, I really hope that this is not down to food colouring!
I am going to be buying Kris Dhillons 'The curry secret this week which I believe is more about BIR's rather than Balti, so hopefully, I can compare the difference and somehow answer my own question.
Once again, thanks for the replys and keep up the great work with this site,
many thanks,
Ray
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hi razor hope i'm not too late! save your money and instead printout bruce edwards curryhouse cookery you will learn much more than KD's book, most of the longest serving members have a copy of kris's book and past through that stage on their way here. you would be taking a step backwards imo ;D
regards
gary :)
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Hi Gary,
Thanks for that. No, you are not too late. I was going to buy the curry secret and the New curry secret this coming Wednesday. Maybe I will hold on to my cash and use it to stock up on ingredients ;D
Gary, can you put up a link to the Bruce Edwards thingy or direct me to it please?
Many thanks,
Ray
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The KD books are only a few quid each and are excellent value nevertheless. Well worth the money and interesting reading/tips.
You should find the Bruce Edward's stuff in the download section here: http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=5.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?board=5.0)
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Razor,
i know what gary is getting at with the KD1 book. I keep mine by my PC for constant reference although i've not made anything from it since joining the site. Since Secret Santa's tip of replacing "garam masala" wherever u see it in the book with curry powder and i'd add and/or spice mix has made it much much better in terms of the main dish recipes. the rest of the book naan, starters etc is well worth the money.
i have the KD2 book which is a real good read. it's not BIR though and i would tag it as traditional. i've not got round to making anything yet so can't really comment on it's true worth.
If there are any specifics u need me to compare in the LB Balti book then just ask.
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Thanks guys. Seeing as though the KD books are only cheap, I will probably buy them anyway. I may be able to use elements of each book along with the Bruce Edwards PDF and come up with my ultimate dish ;D
I will keep you all posted and thanks for all your help and advise. It does seem to be quite a debating point but Im glad I raised the issue, even though I wasn't the first :)
Ray
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The "Balti" is the small serving dish that the curry is served in at the table.
In a BIR if u ask for a curry you will get it in a shallow stainless steel dish.
If you have a Balti it will come in a cast iron dish with handles, The curry should be cooked in the dish that it is served in hence that why it mad of cast iron.
The above is my understanding
Chef
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"Balti...also known as Karahi, it is a Kashmiri curry, freshly cooked and has a rich aroma of spices. It is not really very hot or flavored with chillies, it's just seriously delicious. Traditionally this dryish, slightly oily and spiced up dish is eaten with a bread in the right hand, and the food is scooped up.....their spicing is a little subtle; fresh garlic, ginger, coriander leaf and aromatic spices including clove, cassia bark, cardamoms, aniseed, fennel, cummin and garam masala. Liquor doesnot get served here as the restaurateurs are mostly Pakistani Moslems" (http://monadarling.com/lifestyle/whats-cooking-in-the-balti.html (http://monadarling.com/lifestyle/whats-cooking-in-the-balti.html))
"The food served in the Balti pan are freshly cooked aromatically spiced curries. Balti food at its best is very aromatic, but not excessively spiked with chillies. Traditionally it is eaten without rice or cutlery. Balti bread is used to scoop up the food.... Balti food is both simple in its concept and cooking, and complex in its flavours. True Balti food is dryish and slightly oily and spicily tasty" (http://recipes.chef2chef.net/recipe-archive/25/140741.shtml (http://recipes.chef2chef.net/recipe-archive/25/140741.shtml))
"So what does Afzall say a Balti is?...It's a joke. Hundred per cent joke, he says. It was an invention for the goras (white folk). A Balti is like curry. It exists and doesn?t exist. Do you know what a curry is? I have never had a curry in my life! We tried to civilise the natives by introducing different kinds of cuisine. In particular, we introduced the tandoor and karahi dishes. We soon discovered that the goras had problems pronouncing the word karahi, so as a joke we said why not call it a Balti. It will make life easier for the goras.? (http://www.birminghampost.net/life-leisure-birmingham-guide/postfeatures/2008/11/03/birmingham-asked-what-makes-a-balti-65233-22173155/ (http://www.birminghampost.net/life-leisure-birmingham-guide/postfeatures/2008/11/03/birmingham-asked-what-makes-a-balti-65233-22173155/))
"A Balti curry is cooked quickly over a high heat and is served, sizzling hot, in the Balti dish. Knives and forks are not usually used to eat the curry. Instead, naan bread or chapattis are used to scoop up the curry" (http://www.curryfocus.co.uk/Blog/2007/12/15/balti-curry-what-is-it/ (http://www.curryfocus.co.uk/Blog/2007/12/15/balti-curry-what-is-it/))