Curry Recipes Online
Curry Chat => Lets Talk Curry => Topic started by: emin-j on August 19, 2009, 09:57 PM
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Hi all ,
When making a Curry from 'scratch' would I double up on Spices as I would not be using a Curry Base ?
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I wouldn't double up, that would be too much. If you really want to figure out how much spice is in a base, do some reverse math on the base recipe.
As an example, SnS base yields 2.65 liters, and uses 8 teaspoons of spice (in various ratios of turmeric, cumin, etc).
So if in a single curry you use 300 ml of base (11% of the total base yield), that's the equivalent of 0.88 tsp of spice.
So to get the same spice content in a scratch curry, but wanting to maintain the same spice level, you would add just under a teaspoon of spice to compensate.
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emin-j,
would follow josh's maths for sure.
having made the "curry from scratch" - it's a very intersting question for me though
the restaurant spec called for 1 tbsp of spice based on a "4" person amount of onion/tomato (i used 170g/240g).
on my 1st go i made a 1/4 of the "4" portion and used 3/4 tsp of spice expecting a finished volume of ~200ml. it was nothing like (more like 100ml).
on my 2nd go i made a 3/4 of the "4" portion and stuck with the 3/4 spice. the finished volume was just over 200ml. this being for me a normal standard 1 person portion.
i made madras both times - using LB spice mix (but others would be just as good ie BE, DD, Kushi) along with chilli 1/2 tsp, salt 1/4 tsp.
i thought the amount spicing was fine. i think something is wrong with the volume somehow as i think 1 tbp of spice mix in 4/4 of the "4" portion would be too much.
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I wouldn't double up, that would be too much. If you really want to figure out how much spice is in a base, do some reverse math on the base recipe.
As an example, SnS base yields 2.65 liters, and uses 8 teaspoons of spice (in various ratios of turmeric, cumin, etc).
So if in a single curry you use 300 ml of base (11% of the total base yield), that's the equivalent of 0.88 tsp of spice.
So to get the same spice content in a scratch curry, but wanting to maintain the same spice level, you would add just under a teaspoon of spice to compensate.
Thanks' joshallen2k ,sounds good.
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emin-j,
would follow josh's maths for sure.
having made the "curry from scratch" - it's a very intersting question for me though
the restaurant spec called for 1 tbsp of spice based on a "4" person amount of onion/tomato (i used 170g/240g).
on my 1st go i made a 1/4 of the "4" portion and used 3/4 tsp of spice expecting a finished volume of ~200ml. it was nothing like (more like 100ml).
on my 2nd go i made a 3/4 of the "4" portion and stuck with the 3/4 spice. the finished volume was just over 200ml. this being for me a normal standard 1 person portion.
i made madras both times - using LB spice mix (but others would be just as good ie BE, DD, Kushi) along with chilli 1/2 tsp, salt 1/4 tsp.
i thought the amount spicing was fine. i think something is wrong with the volume somehow as i think 1 tbp of spice mix in 4/4 of the "4" portion would be too much.
Thanks' JerryM ,I am going to have another go at producing a Madras Curry Sauce tomorrow , this time using 1 Onion and 2 Tomatoes ( all finely chopped )plus Garlic,Ginger,and 2 fresh Green Chillies .Unfortunately the amounts of ingredients in the recipes I received following my Cooking Class are nothing like the Chef used on the day so I am trying by trial and error :-\ and memory ::) Why do people use ' Spice Mix ' when you can use all the individual Spices in whatever amounts you need ?
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Why do people use ' Spice Mix ' when you can use all the individual Spices in whatever amounts you need ?
Because its generally accepted as BIR practice. If most all curries require some level of general spicing (coriander, cumin, turmeric, curry powder...) they find it simpler to come up with a house mix, rather than individually spice out the curries that require similar spicing anyway.
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My second attempt at a ' Curry from Scratch '
After a dismal result last week I thought I would have another go ,so cutting down on the amount of Onion and Tomatoes ( a 2 portion Curry )I set about as before chopping all the ingredients finely.
Whilst cooking the Curry I added the Spices from the sNs Madras recipe which I have used very successfully in the past.I also added just under a TSP of BE Spice Mix to make up for not using a Base Sauce which would have had Spice in ,the result was as last time almost tasteless :o , to rescue the Curry I added 1 heaped TSP of Garam Masala and a TSP of Rajah Curry Powder. This was a similar problem as I had last time , I just cant seem to get the balance of the Spices right :'( Also when creating what will be the ' sauce ' you add water ,this makes the Curry thin and watery compared to the Curries I have made with a base sauce ,if you reduce it down to thicken up the Curry you don't have enough for 2 servings :-\
My wife is also a Curryholic and is so far not impressed with Curries from Scratch :-[ The texture of the sauce is not smooth as a Curry using a base sauce also my wife said there was no ' Toffee like aroma ' as there usually is ,I also noticed the absence of the ' Curry Aroma 'around the house and in my clothes and in my car ! ;D I do like the idea of using fresh ingredients to create a fresh Curry but I am wondering if ' the taste ' we have been looking for is is due to the using of a base sauce and the ' special ' flavour it brings :-\ I am still no lover of base from the freezer compared to fresh made base nor do I fancy using ' old fryer oil ' :P But one thing I did add to the Curry which made a definite improvement to the richness was a table spoon of Butter Ghee.
I haven't give up on the Curry from Scratch idea but wonder if that method is more suitable for certain Curries more than others.
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/eminj1951/CurryFromScratch2?authkey=Gv1sRgCN3D4tKnr5eWGg&feat=directlink
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I haven't give up on the Curry from Scratch idea but wonder if that method is more suitable for certain Curries more than others.
Who knows? I've been meaning to try this approach for years, in order to avoid making vast quantities of base. Your recent interest reminds me that I must get around to giving it a try.
My objective will be to create the same near-BIR flavour and texture as I can by using base. If I succeed, I will report back here. I will, however, refrain from reporting every trial, tribulation and element of R&D along the way. I see it as data overload, which just floods the forum with less-than-interesting material.
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I haven't give up on the Curry from Scratch idea but wonder if that method is more suitable for certain Curries more than others.
Who knows? I've been meaning to try this approach for years, in order to avoid making vast quantities of base. Your recent interest reminds me that I must get around to giving it a try.
My objective will be to create the same near-BIR flavour and texture as I can by using base. If I succeed, I will report back here. I will, however, refrain from reporting every trial, tribulation and element of R&D along the way. I see it as data overload, which just floods the forum with less-than-interesting material.
George , To recreate the texture /consistency of a BIR Curry I do believe you can only do this by using a base sauce or liquidising the common ingredients that make up most base sauces and what I am looking to do next as chriswg found at his Curry lesson is make a fresh base sauce everytime I make a Curry ,how practical this is I wont know until I try it but chriswg seemed to find it OK.I'm trying to stay away from using frozen base sauce.
If you decide to make a Curry using your base recipe george please post your results ,if you can post some photo's it sometimes makes a post more interesting than text alone ,there are probably many members on the forum who will appreciate your efforts.
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emin-j,
i've never used frozen base - it just does not sit well. i make a 800g onion base or 7 portions - it gives us 2 curry nights during the week (i x2 to include a weekend).
i do think curry from scratch (and i mean BIR) is achievable but it would take some time perfecting - i too have good lady telling me to stop messing about though.
i very much agree on the butter/ghee although i've adopted marg. i do think the base has a big part to play but the cooking/frying is not to be left out either.
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emin - Actually, thinking about it, I'm probably not far off achieving your objective, already. I've seldom made a base which is based on more than 2 onions, and I don't cook the base for much more than 30 mins either. So it's hardly any more than a single serving size already. I've never been convinced that you get superior results by preparing a huge batch of base, like based on several kilos of onions. If your criteria includes a slightly shorter prep time, then I'm sure my 30 mins could be cut to 15 or 20 mins without much disadvantage in terms of flavour. And, yes, of course it's liquidised.
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emin-j,
i've never used frozen base - it just does not sit well. i make a 800g onion base or 7 portions - it gives us 2 curry nights during the week (i x2 to include a weekend).
i do think curry from scratch (and i mean BIR) is achievable but it would take some time perfecting - i too have good lady telling me to stop messing about though.
i very much agree on the butter/ghee although i've adopted marg. i do think the base has a big part to play but the cooking/frying is not to be left out either.
JerryM
From the time I spent in the kitchen of the local T/A and they put some Butter Ghee in their cooking oil I have used it most times ,it definitely brings a richness to the Curry.
The 'cooking from scratch 'is not as easy as I thought but have not given up on it yet ,I think as I make 2 Curries on a Saturday night and I like my Curry hotter than the Wife's I will make the Wife's with a fresh made base and mine from ' scratch ' hopefully I can learn something that way ::) Can you recommend the ingredients and method ( I prefer a fried base sauce over a boiled one )for a 1 portion base ? What do you think of the base in chriswg's latest Madras experience.
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I think with any curry made from scratch, you need a large onion, and fry it gently till it is light brown in colour, soft and transluscent, I usually use a mixture of both oil and a little butter as this brings out the flavour and the butter adds as a thickening agent too. When the onion is almost done I then add the pureed garlic and ginger and cook that with the onion. It doesn't need as much cooking as the onion and if garlic is cooked for too long or too hot it imparts a bitter taste which I think ruins the taste of a curry.
I then blend all this into a puree and use that as my base. You can then cook it in a pan with tomato paste and any spice mix you like depending on the type of curry you want to make.
The Kashmiri Chicken Masala I posted on here started out that way and its one of the best curries I have ever made from scratch.
I hope this helps :)
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emin-j,
i can only help with base methods as i only have this experience ie i've no real traditional Indian cooking experience. all of 976bar's recipes that i've used have been spot on - i would follow that method.
the Kashmiri although i've put a BIR slant on 976bar's version is for me and the good lady simply fantastic.
i really can't see what's wrong with making base though. the versatility that it offers is second to none - the ability to add small amounts of ingredients is key for me. the effort ain't that much either - sure u have to be in the house for ~4hrs but u're not a slave to it.
anyhow against my better judgement - a 1 portion base:
veg oil 70ml
marg 5ml
onion 115g
carrot 30g
coriander stalk 3g
garlic 9g
salt 0.5ml
ground cumin 0.5ml
ground coriander 1.5ml
turmeric 1.0ml
chilli 0.5ml
fennel 1.5ml,
roasted wholes spice 1ml (tgad2007 post, in ratio cardamon 1, bay 2, anis 2, cinnamon 2, casia 1, black pepper 1, fennel 5)
initial water 40ml
coconut block 7g
reclaim 55ml oil (before blending)
add 150ml water for stage 2 (lid off, after blending)
add thinning water at end typ 15ml to hopefully give finished vol of ~300ml
stage 1 simmer (lid on 2 hr), stage 2 simmer 1 to 2 hr lid off.
original base here http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3462.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=3462.0)
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Hi Guys,
How long can I keep base in the fridge for?
I've had some in there for several weeks and was going to make a madras with it today, but I'm not sure if it's well past its sell by date or not?
Any advice would be most welcomed :)
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How long can I keep base in the fridge for? I've had some in there for several weeks and was going to make a madras with it today, but I'm not sure if it's well past its sell by date or not? Any advice would be most welcomed :)
I wouldn't risk it - several days maybe, but not several weeks.
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I think with any curry made from scratch, you need a large onion, and fry it gently till it is light brown in colour, soft and transluscent, I usually use a mixture of both oil and a little butter as this brings out the flavour and the butter adds as a thickening agent too. When the onion is almost done I then add the pureed garlic and ginger and cook that with the onion. It doesn't need as much cooking as the onion and if garlic is cooked for too long or too hot it imparts a bitter taste which I think ruins the taste of a curry.
I then blend all this into a puree and use that as my base. You can then cook it in a pan with tomato paste and any spice mix you like depending on the type of curry you want to make.
The Kashmiri Chicken Masala I posted on here started out that way and its one of the best curries I have ever made from scratch.
I hope this helps :)
Thanks' 976bar ,That is basically how i have been cooking my ' from scratch ' curries which is as we were shown at the cookery class ,except the puree part and this is what seems to cause the biggest problem I just cannot seem to cook it down enough to get a smooth sauce ( for a Madras anyway ). We were shown a CTM and the Cream that was added is what gave that dish it's smooth and creamy texture so your idea to puree the ingredients creating a base sauce sounds good .The other problem I have had is despite putting in plenty of Spice the flavour is just not there :'( I just cant understand it ! My previous Curries made with a base have been excellent.
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Thanks' JerryMfor your time and effort ,having all this info can only be good ;)
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How long can I keep base in the fridge for?
i aim to use within 7 days. 10 days is the cut off for me. i go on smell and chuck it out when the smell changes.
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How long can I keep base in the fridge for?
i aim to use within 7 days. 10 days is the cut off for me. i go on smell and chuck it out when the smell changes.
Goodness! I'm not sure I'd be happy keeping it for more than 2 or 3 days in the fridge! :-\
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Surely all this talk about "not using a base" or "curry from scratch" is simply a traditional Indian method of cooking curries? :-\
The difference being that:
a) BIRs generally make a large pot of a mildly spiced and, therefore, versatile, base that can be used to make a multitude of curries, for time-saving convenience
b) A small-scale version of the base is basically the same as the large-scale version except that the convenience factor is lost for making multiple curries
c) A traditional method is essentially the same as a small-scale version (i.e. an onion/garlic, etc, base made "from scratch") apart from the fact that you might choose to blend it to get a smoother consistency