Curry Recipes Online
Beginners Guide => Hints, Tips, Methods and so on.. => Cooking Methods => Topic started by: Cory Ander on August 22, 2006, 12:53 PM
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Dear all,
Looking through the various curry bases here, it is obvious that onions are the primary and common ingredient to all of them.
However, there is one particularly significant difference in the way in which the curry basis are prepared; whether the onions are fried, boiled, or a combination of the two?
I reckon one of the most difficult things to replicate at home is the sweetness of BIR curries. I'm sure that this largely due to the way in which the onions are prepared. It seems to me that poorly cooked onions are rather bitter and that only prolonged cooking times impart the necessary sweetness?
I would be very interested in people's opinions, therefore, on whether it is best to fry the onions, or to boil them, or to both fry then boil them, and why?
Thanks
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Cory Ander,
I boil the onions with a few slices of potato, turmeric and the magic ingredient - 1/2 Teaspoon of Bicarbonate of Soda which breaks down the onions superfast and takes away any acidity. You just try it and it cuts a 2 hour boil down to 30 mins.
S :o
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I was always led to believe the longer you fried onions the sweeter they got. The thing I always have trouble with is when do onions become golden brown??......mike
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i believe the best is fry first or sweat the onions as u dont want to brown them then boil in the water with the other stuff and simmer for 1 hour.
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Add a little salt to the onions as well when frying , as this will help to draw some of the moisture out .
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The way I see it is that BIR curries incorporate two separate shots of onion/garlic/ginger with each shot being cooked in a different way. It is the combination of the two distinct cooking methods which makes the final curries tasty.
One shot is the (almost) fresh onions/garlic/ginger which are stir-fried at high heat around the start of each final curry. This element presumably goes brown.
The other shot is the base sauce, being primarily boiled.
So final onions = boiled onions + fried onions
I'm not sure this is correct but it's the way I see it.
Therefore if you brown the onions in the base sauce, you miss out on the flavour of simple, long-boiled onions.
Regards
George
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Hi george,
The onions I have seen added in the final dish have always been pre-fried. Frying onions at maximum heat makes them bitter (alledgedly)
cheers
Mark
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The onions I have seen added in the final dish have always been pre-fried. Frying onions at maximum heat makes them bitter (alledgedly)
Very true Mark , thats why when saut?ing onions, always use low or medium heat. The bitterness is quite pronounced on a high heat .
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read this old post, it might answer some of your questions on onions and sweetness.
http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=176.0 (http://www.curry-recipes.co.uk/curry/index.php?topic=176.0)
Ashes
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Thanks for the link Ashes.
I read all 9 pages of the post (twice!), but there doesn't appear to be anything about boiling or frying the onions in the curry base, or its effect on the sweetness of the onions? Am I missing something? Or did you mean to provide a link to a different post?
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Hi Cory, the point i noticed was referring to the way the chefs adapt each batch of curry base depending on the onions. Sometimes they add ketchup if the onions arent sweet enough or tamerind to give a slightly more sour taste to tone down the sweetness.
"at the end he told me making a gravy is a like any thing else in cooking you have to taste and adjust ingredients from batch to batch"
Also i noticed something of interest;
"do you fry garlic and ginger in the beginning of making the gravy or you add it at the end ?...
one of the chefs that i employed was doing it in the beginning and another one was adding it at the end with the oil ....it depend on which chef."
I would imagine some boil and others fry their onions, exactly like we do here at cr0. I like to fry the onions first for baltis but with something like the KD base (boiled) it tastes far superior once its been frozen 24 hrs or more.
Ive noticed in some trad recipes they tend to fry the onions on a very low heat for up to 20 minutes, if youve ever tasted a hotdog onions that are left hanging around on the griddle youll remember they are also very sweet. I think its to do with the starch turning to sugars?? (not sure). I know sugar turns to alcohol ;)
The important thing to remember is pureed onions will always be bitter if they are not cooked first. With boiled and then pureed onions you will always have to add oil later to create that sweetness.. effectively frying the onions in puree form. I suppose frying the onions briefly beforehand is creating the sweetness at the start instead of the end.
You can always peel the onions and leave them in iced water this will remove alot of the bitterness and is great for salads.
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Thanks for your responses guys. As far as I can deduce, this is what people are saying about how to cook the onions for the curry base:
Those that boil the onions (2/7):
Stew? but doesn't say why. Believes that adding bicarbonate of soda breaks them down quicker and reduces acidity (and bitterness?)
George? believes that a long boil is required for "the flavour of" long-boiled onions?
Those that fry the onions (2/7):
Mike (presumably?) - believes frying them for longer makes them sweeter
CurryCanuck? but doesn't say why. Believes that adding salt "will help draw" the moisture out? and that low heat is required to avoid bitterness
Those that fry and then boil the onions (1/7):
Dragon - fries (sweats) them, and then boils them, but doesn't say why
Others (2/7):
MarkJ - doesn't say, but believes frying at high temperatures makes them bitter
Ashes - uses both methods, depending on the circumstances, but doesn't say why. Believes that frying, on low heat, makes them sweeter. Seems to believe that boiled onions will not be sweet unless oil is subsequently added?
Conclusions:
- Some people boil the onions, some fry them and some fry then boil them (approximately in equal measures)
- Frying onions on a low heat, for longer, makes them sweeter (there seems to be consensus here at least?)
- Boiling onions, for longer, makes them sweeter (?) and develops the boiled onion flavour (but I am uncertain about this conclusion?)
Have I drawn the right conclusions? Does boiling onions for longer make them sweeter? Or does boiling them not sweeten them at all (as Ashes seems to suggest)?
Does anyone else have any views on, what appears to me to be, a fundamental question of whether to boil or to fry the onions (or both) for the curry base and why? Or maybe I am mistaken in thinking that this is a fundamental question?
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Ashes, Cory and others
That's two excellent posts you've both made there. What an interesting subject! I doubt if boiling onions in water creates much sweetness but I may be wrong. The best suggestion would be to try it as a bit of R&D. Boil 2 or 3 onions in just enough water, for 1 or 2 hours, so they don't dry out. Gently fry another 2 or 3 onions in oil for as long as it takes for them to look like hot dog onions (not too burned). I know the latter result is delicious and sweet, but as an input to base sauce, I simply don't know which is best. There are so many other permutations and combinations, I've been experimenting with, that I haven't tried it.
I still favour MarkJ's base sauce and it tastes so damn good, that I don't see the need for much further work on base sauces. I also added a bit of coconut and general purpose seasoning to make it a bit more like Terry's base sauce. This variation is good, too.
Regards
George